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Dragonguard - why isn’t it focused on dragons?

But… Dragonguard as a generalist is probably one of the best frontline classes right now. Holy Armour is great, and his tree allows you to start with Barrier, +2 to all skills, 15% start mana for your team, and triple skull damage against burning enemies. All that and more in one troop is far from “utter trash”.

And if you want to use the 3x burning damage… Lots of weapons burn the first enemy once upgraded.

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Well Dragonguard may be lucky with some of the talent selections it got and calling it utter trash may be too harsh. But even with these talents sounding like a lot i don’t find it remarkable, i’d still prefer a Gorgotha upfront.
Other Hero classes are less lucky with their talent choices and fare worse.

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Basically, the whole idea the devs had is that each class represents three things. If you think back to the dragon storyline, you might remember what it was about and how Raven was a total jerk during it while Visk - the one who taught the hero how to be a Dragonguard - was the loyal dude who wanted to help and protect his people and their eggs. The trees picked for the class (Fire, Morale, Guardian) therefore are meant to represent what the idea behind the class stands for.

As these things are shared between classes, however, you end up with a mess that seems to fit the class not at all. The thing is, I like the idea the devs had with this, as the planning is obvious, but the end result - what matters in terms of gameplay - is so all over the place that it’s hard to see that plan behind the mess.

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my question is and i am sure i know allready the answer : the dragon guard class doesnt count as a dragon anymore or?
or any class dont count anymore as a troop type

He should have kept his type. You can see it if you put your Hero in a team with the class Dragonguard :wink: .
Yeah that’s crappy…

ty yes saw it just right now thank you

I wonder if surprise surprise, the talent trees aren’t bugged with the wrong talent.

Level 100 mechanist, all constructs gain 10 life. It should be mechs, not constructs.

It’s not a Mechanist talent, class specific modifiers are handled by traits. Each hero class has access to three of sixteen talent trees, most of which are shared between multiple classes. The Construct boost belongs to the Knowledge tree, shared among Bard, Mechanist, Oracle, Priest and Sorcerer. Changing it to a Mech boost would probably cause some of the other classes to raise an eyebrow, now it’s at least universally useless. :wink:

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Yeah that does make sense, but don’t underestimate the bug making ability of the devs.

It’s good that you have other boosts besides just mech so you don’t feel tied to just mechs.

Mechanist level 40 is a good one. Choose between:

  • Mentor - all allies gain 1 magic; or
  • Gift of fire - all red allies gain 1 magic.

Decisions decisions…

5Myb6x6

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Admittedly I had forgotten that weapons can be upgraded to burn so that one option could work for any team, so at least I’ll eventually be able to utilize the final tier.

I still find it odd that something that revolves around dragons (traits) has a talent tree that doesn’t have anything to do with dragons.

I agree that the rest of the tree is pretty great, really I was expressing my discontent with the fact that the class should be tuned towards the type it is, for at least one of the tree options. Instead of mech or Raksha it should be dragons because that fits thematically.

But it makes a lot more sense now that I know other classes share trees and that these aren’t actually unique. They took the cop out way of doing it.

Most of the level 100 talents feel way to specialized. For Bard it’s either a boost to Raksha (:face_with_raised_eyebrow:), Constructs (:grimacing:) or Urska (:angry:). Which boils down to the last, most difficult to reach tier essentially offering nothing even remotely useful in almost every situation.

I’d rather see more universal talents for that final tier. Do something useful to the hero/first/last/weakest/strongest/lowest mana/highest mana/every troop. Or something detrimental to the first/last/weakest/strongest/lowest mana/highest mana/every opponent troop. At the start of the battle, every turn, when matching a specific color or when matching 4/5 gems.

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Let’s look at OP’s original complaints.

I’m so sorry for your TDS team but there is more than one dragon. This synergizes very well with Sheggra, and you could make a “3 dragons and Infernus” team where the hero’s weapon combined with this might actually be stronger than Sheggra’s ability.

DRACOS 1337 has this ability and is a Dragon/Mech. Looking over the Mech types, there are a lot that are boosted by armor. Could it be that this is some kind of acknowledgement that you might want to be Dragonguard for, say, GW reasons, but use a Mech team in another event? There are some possibilities here that might get interesting if more Dragon/Mech troops or Mechs that synergize with dragons appear.

OK, so there’s no Dragon/Raksha to talk about. But Ubastet’s pretty damn powerful and already self-boosts its Magic. So what if we make Hero / TDS / Glitterclaw / Ubastet"? We get 3 dragons worth of bonuses, and Ubastet’s gaining +2 Attack and +1 Magic every turn, not to mention Faerie Fire makes Ubastet’s ability “Destroy 2 troops.” Very nice.

The purpose of these abilities aren’t to make the hero into an uber-troop like Infernus that you can put on any team to make it more powerful. If “Dragonguard + 3 dragons” were insanely strong, it’d be as problematic as Divines. The purpose is to have a powerful and flexible troop that opens the door to teams that can’t happen without the hero. The things you listed mean that hybrid Dragon/Mech and Dragon/Raksha troops AND teams are more powerful today than they were yesterday. The concept of a Dragon/Mech would’ve been “meh” before this. Now we know there’s a class that will specifically benefit that type.

That means, in the future, lots of dual-type creatures are going to be more powerful than they look, and several hero classes are more likely to have a niche.

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Sure you can make a ragtag team that somehow utilizes most of your weird class bonuses and completely ignore how it antisynergizes with any of the classes traits types etc. But then you are better off simply shutting the Hero out and make an actual synergizing team instead.

So use an Ubastet in your Dragon team to get that sweet Raksha +1 attack bonus that’s pointless because your Hero is infront trying to utilize that burn bonus skulldamage, or that sweet sweet mechs+2 armor for that one Dragon in your team that gets the bonus while not needing it, because your Hero is the one in front taking the hits, while others simply use Ubastet in teams where it actually owns, you know non-Dragon teams.

You can spin it any way you want, the talents tend to heavily antisynergize with the concept of the class itself and its traits, obviously to different degrees depending on class, and i’d say Dragonguard is not the worst in that regard.

I agree on dual-type troops potentially not necessarily being more powerful but opening up more creative options in conjunction with those hero class bonuses, but in practice chances to do so are already thrown in the wind by the tree allocations.
For example Titan, a class heavily shoehorned to team with giants by traits(why else pick Titan really?) has talents profiting 4 different other trooptypes and none of them are currently present on any giant dual-type troop.

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Let’s also notice in your post you talk a lot about mythics, which are very hard to get. Great for you and your luck, grats!

Not to mention you point out the only (one of the only?) mech dragon(s), who honestly sucks.

And sheggra is like one dragon (nonmythic) that works with the burning effectively.

If you did read my full post you’ll notice I’m speaking in a broader range of dragons. Not fitting only 2 dragons…

You act like what I’m saying isn’t true… like this dragonguard class has to do with dragons (plural - typically referencing more than 2)

Edit: I’ve also never said it should make dragons insanely strong. I said that it should benefit dragons in some way. One talent tree should be about dragons (hello there are three options, one could be general, one working with the type of the class/hero, and one for duals)

I think you are twisting My words to fit your prerogative. It’s okay to have a different opinion but you should try to not sound so aggressive.

@Mekkalyn Answering the OP title “Why”…
Because the developers only created color categories NOT Racial categories. They randomly slapped in a few race options for kicks on the color categories. Square Peg, round hole, but the devs were holding a hammer, so its all good.

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Definitely would approve of specific trees per classes. That’s honestly what I had thought they were doing and was excited for. Thanks for the link, very interesting.

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Off-topic: Huh… @Mekkalyn is back too, but i guess you wouldn’t recognize my actual nick on the forums. I used to be Ivar. :wave:

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Pretty funny coming from the person who defends Doomskulls and Doomstorm as being good for the game because it gives us something equal to InfernIsh. And this is a problem how? :thinking:

If you’re planning on maxing your classes, you’re committing to waiting on mythics. It’s not hard to get them. Do your daily dungeons, hoard your keys wisely, and you will be rewarded.

You didn’t say what you wanted, you just complained that what you got isn’t it. Forgive me for trying to figure out where you were going with your narrative. Personally, I stand behind the ideas I had: Dragonguard is more versatile since it can branch out. Versatility is sometimes nice.

My real worry is if the devs shoot for the power level of Divines/Doomskulls again, they’ll aim high and make something even stronger. Then that thing might stick around because they decide they didn’t nerf Divines/Doomskulls, etc. I do think the game’s a little more exciting in the notches below. Considering how many extra events are going on, it’d be neat if “Divines/Doomskulls are what I use for scaling events, I use other teams for fun”.

There is a human being inside this pony. We are irrational. My wants don’t always align or make sense. Doomskulls/Divines are what we have, they were mistakes but I don’t want the devs to take them away. On the other hand, making more of them isn’t a good idea. My one exception: I am perversely happy with Doomskulls because it’s cheaper to assemble than Divines. So if they make a better and cheaper high-end team, I’m game. Arming newbies is my kind of gig.

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