Community Mythic Tier Lists

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I had a question for you and I remember when I 1st started GoW, Your videos helped me to understand the game better than any one AND from time to time help me do better at it.

Since I’ve switch from my PC/Android GoW to the PS4, my troops are still pretty basic. I’ve only pulled a few Mythics and not many Legendary…Or what I would call my keystone ‘type’ troops to build many good GW Team

Still, any suggestion with the ones below?
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  • High King Irongut
  • Phoenicia
  • Wulfgorak (I hope I spelled that co
    There was a couple of non-mythic I thought might be usable, but :kissing::dash:
    I dunno.
  1. Emperor Lang
  2. King Averlorn
  3. Holy St. Astra

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Besides 'Bone Dragon, Mab, & a few others, thats ALL of what I’d call my Keystone type troops as of now, so, how can I make some of those above help out in my Guild War defenses? Are there any good low/mid level tier teams I can make with them?

Any~~~~~Way, thanks for any sort of help, (also to anyone else answering this thread.

:v:t5: Phoenix Flair :crossed_swords::fire::rainbow::dove: Sephiroth’s Girl

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A few things:

  • Not sure if you’re addressing your comment to Tacet or Keylime (Eric doesn’t do any video content AFAIK);

  • You probably want to create a new thread for this, because this thread is really for discussing Mythic tier lists;

  • When asking for teambuilding help (why there isn’t a dedicated thread to this, I don’t know), you’ll want to provide people access to all the troops you have. You can do this by creating a profile on GOWDB.com.

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63

Updated the mythic tierlist with Aquaticus and Vash (with bonus Class tierlist update as well).

Overall I think Aquaticus is a very solid troop, nothing overpowered, nothing devastating, but a very needed blue mana having mythic that’s solid in the damage department and loops.

Vash is still meh. :stuck_out_tongue:

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  1. When it comes to class evaluation, I think you’re overlooking a major aspect of it.

Instead of looking at Dragonguard as a better class at using Fire Blade or a different class can do Self-Cleanse better, you have to realize that Tidecaller is the only class currently with a 50% mana start AND self-cleanse or Heirophant is the only class with Fire Blade that can self-cleanse if someone tries to Entangle at the start of the match. What good is Fire Blade if you can’t actually do any damage to get the 3x effect? Its the unique combinations that give a class value.

Also when it comes to class evaluation, not every class needs skull protection. Some hero classes aren’t designed to be in the first slot and that’s ok. Those classes can still win matches quickly without being the front line troop. Something like Corsair isn’t designed to be in the first slot and even thinking of using Dodge over Water Mastery for a 3rd Blue Link bonus is sketchy af.

  1. “TINA, I don’t think, is as amazing as we all think, but she’s just very dangerous.”

I mean, if something very dangerous isn’t something we call amazing, than what are we supposed to call amazing?

When it comes to TINA-9000, TINA-9000 is one of the better troops in some of the events that it can be featured in. Mech Invasion, Delves with Potions, Class event for sure. Its weird to say it doesn’t have a place in events, because really, how many troops do?

I don’t know how you do it, but a full mana enemy TINA-9000 in a PvP environment always makes me nervous. There’s a non-insignificant chance it’ll double hit something and take out an important part of my team, where as I can shrug off an Infernus or Obsidius cast. I can’t control random gem cascades AI tend to get sometimes and TINA-9000 can start at half mana. 12 mana for THAT effect… I’m glad TINAs are nice to you. One almost made a mockery of you in that other play better guide video, if you didn’t get lucky with a dodge.

  1. Meta teams should not define a troop’s value.

Infernus is barely “meta” anywhere anymore and yet you still have it up in S Tier. The fact is “Meta” teams are just effective teams that people bandwagon on and that doesn’t always mean other troops are bad. They just don’t have the spotlight on them.

3.5. Unless you’re running one of the very few troop that benefits from the burning effect (Fire Blade hero, Elemaugrim, Fire Giant), burn is a very insignificant effect. I would venture to say its only good for popping barriers.

You dislike traits that give benefits per turn, but by that very result, burn is only 3 damage per turn. Very rarely is that extra 3 damage enough to change the breakpoints in the number of casts I need to win a match. Tack on immune to burning, impervious, trait effects (triggering Humility/Orcs/Orbweaver summons) and the burn doesn’t always have a use and isn’t always a good thing.

Defense buffs aren’t always a bad thing for offensive purposes. Barrier can keep a player alive long enough to build up enough mana to put up a counter offensive to snatch a win from defeat. Cleanse/Bless is another defensive buff that allows the player to go offensive.

Submerge is quite situational, but when it matters, its definitely a game changing effect. AoE troops aren’t in season currently, but some still do see play.

Queen Titania, Queen Mab, The Possessed King, King Gobtruffle, Doomed weapons, Dawnbringer just to name some.

Submerge isn’t good enough to waste a troop cast to apply the effect, but applying full team protection from AoE from a simple 4/5 match can be amazing. The old guard teams like dragons just can’t touch you anymore unless you let it.

Submerge also applies to split damage.

  1. Looping potential is not always a good thing either because it leaves a potential chance of backfiring and setting the AI up with a really good next turn and loop potential doesn’t really function well under Freeze. Sometimes its better to just do a hard hitting move and pass the bad board back to the AI.

There’s many times where I’d rather just use Ketras or TINA-9000 get 1-2 confirmed kills and work on finishing off a weakened team then gamble on a turn back and fail. Anyone who has ever used The Wild Queen and missed knows that sometimes the confirmed kill is just better.

Ask yourself this: Would you rather gamble an Infernus cast against Yao Gaui/ Queen Titania with a Fire Storm going where a 2nd cast would kill their entire team or cast Ketras the Bull killing off Yao Guai and Queen Titania and leave their team relatively harmless? If Infernus misses, YG/QT get a bunch of 4/5 matches and goes nuts.

Another example: Fang Moor is a terrible faction team to use since 3 troops forcefully alter the board as their spell. Sure they have looping potential, but that doesn’t always mean it leaves you in a place you want to be. Horned Asp nearly becomes a necessity to not self-sabotage on bad luck.

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But tell me how you really feel…

Feel free to disagree, but you’re not exactly presenting as someone who wants to be disagreed with or is open to genuine discussion about it…so forgive me if I don’t engage. You made a lot of comments there that assume I know very little about the game, so my apologies if I’m coming across as defensive here.

I immediately apologized about the TINA error I made when someone explained it to me…so if that makes me a dunce in your eyes, so be it.

If you think Hierophant deserves a higher tier rating, if you think TINA should be higher than I placed her (despite her being in the top 10), if you choose to believe I think every hero needs to be in the top slot and be skull resistant, if you don’t think I understand how submerge works, if you think burning isn’t immensely more useful than submerge due to Fireblade existing and popping barriers…that’s fine.

Opinions aren’t facts. I disagree with some of yours. You seem to disagree with most of mine.

You just won’t see me assuming you’re an idiot for it. I’d appreciate the same courtesy.

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Color me curious, but what rank in Guild Wars do you play?

@TheIdleOne is in Guild Wars rank one, and consistently plots and plans to place first. With his Thief friends of course. But Idle’s opinion is based often on having everything mythic and maxed, playing against the same.

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My guild is in Bracket II, and I have just about everything maxed and mythic as well.

I’m not doubting anyone’s credentials, I’m just stating that the tone isn’t conducive to actual discussion. You can tell when someone likes to hear themselves talk and when someone is attempting to have a productive conversation.

But none of this is what this thread is about. My apologies for derailing.

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My best advice, listen to idle.

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^^^and try to extrapolate, because there’s more he’s not saying.

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Of course there is. And @TheIdleOne talks too much as it is :zipper_mouth_face:

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Ummm…this took an interesting turn? I’m going to break my reactions into several replies, to keep things organized.

First, thanks for the updates Key. There is an alarming lack of up-to-date content guiding players for a game that’s been around as long as GoW has, and you do a good and thorough job, even though I am not really a video-watcher.

Re: Mythic Tier lists, of the three big ones out there, I think Tacets most closely reflects my current thinking, and still do after this latest update (please update yours @EliteMasterEric!). While there are a lot of minor things I’d disagree with, here are the overarching issues I have:

  • The Top 3 tiers are generally ok. The three in B who really stand out: Megavore, TINA, and Arachnaean Weaver, who all are significantly better than the rest of the B-tiers. Few mythics can match Megavore in both pvp and scaling content. Even the addition of reflect, which counters it somewhat, doesn’t affect its value too much. TINA is the true damage champ of the entire game, not bothered by stealthy or submerge (or entangle, as we discussed!), and Idle does a good job covering why having it in B is problematic. This brings me to THE placing that I take the most issue with of the three - Arachnaean Weaver. This mythic does it all, and makes almost any team you put it on better if used properly. Having these three on the same level as VoO and Elemaugrim/Famine is hard for me to understand.

  • C seems to be a bit of a grab bag tier. I think on closer examination, you’ll see that there are probably three levels of strength included in the provided C-tier.

    • On the low end, Plague being in C is a head-scratcher - Draakulis and Fallen Valdis are better (and belong in C-tier IMO). F-tier is not something I assign recklessly - many troops have at least some niche utility. That said, Plague is a hard F. Same for Tian Yi, Doomclaw (you convinced me, Idle), Abynissia, and Xathenos.

    • On the high end, Skadi, Undine, and Suna are way too good to be in C-tier with the rest of these.

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Meanwhile, I agree with most everything Idle said.

My thinking is that “meta teams” are teams that are currently good, regardless of popularity. For example, beast looping teams are not terribly popular, but I’d say they are “meta” because they can consistently beat any team in the game you throw at them, including the popular teams.

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I really disagree with this thinking. Just because you do well at a game does not mean that you understand the game, or can explain it better than somebody ranked lower. ESPECIALLY in a game like GoW, where brainless grinding and/or spending real money or resources (not to mention stupid RNG) can affect your success rate more than actual skill or knowledge.

I respect Idle because what he says makes sense and he takes the time to explain the logic behind his opinions, not for whatever his placing is in GW.

On that note, hopefully any personal stuff aired here doesn’t impact posting habits. I really appreciate how both Key and Idle contribute to the actually useful discussions that take place on this board.

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The criteria that troops are ranked at is based on the non-nintendo environment, in competitive pvp where all troops are available. You don’t play in that environment, that’s why you don’t understand rankings in that environment.

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Obviously it’s based on the PC environment, nobody’s saying otherwise.

This isn’t rocket science. There are lots of people who don’t play Guild Wars rank one who understand troop rankings and how the game works.

And I don’t get your anti-Switch bias either, for that matter. Are you trying to say anything in particular that I said is wrong? If so, let’s hear it.

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I am in the process of reconsidering how my list is done; what my qualifiers for tiers are and even whether the list is in Steam (it’s good for visibility but hard to work with, technically speaking. It’s slow to use, doesn’t track change history, and isn’t the best for Mobile devices).

If you’re wondering, I rate Shade of Zorn F, Gaard at B, and Aquaticus at A, debating placing it in S since it fills essentially the same role as Infernus as discussed above.

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After using TWQ for at least a month I would say the confirmed kill is always better. When you miss with TWQ and hand a board full of skulls to the enemy that then kills your top troop and triggers her bone storm you are pretty much screwed.

78

I watched your class tier list and I agree with a lot but couldn’t disagree with Sunspear more. Sunspear and Dragonguard are pretty similar but I consider Dragonguard far superior. When using those classes you need hero is first slot to get the triple skull damage and you need protection Dragonguard has a barrier at the start of the battle and skull reduction where as Sunspear only has root trap which entangles the first enemy but that can easily be cleansed very quickly or they might be immune to entangle. I also don’t find the fire storm to be that important when I’m trying to get a lot of skulls and if I did want it Dragonguard starts the battle with it and infernus gets it when it kills an enemy which is very easy with triple skull damage. Also Dragonguard has banisment to get rid of bless to be able to burn enemies.

I do think Sunspear is an amazing class when running something like TDS that explodes the board and uses the red or key team or anything red with Leprechaun.

Overall I would say both Dragonguard and Sunspear are A tier classes.

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Thanks for the update! Looking forward to the end result, whenever it comes out.

Especially looking forward to seeing what you’ve found with CoG, that rating is surprisingly high. Especially since you aren’t a big fan of The Wild Queen.

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Final Tierlist Image

Updated with the latest batch of mythics and some extra considerations for explore mode viability.

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