Deeds - Discussion and Critique

Except in GW there already IS a stat discrepancy, when a lower ranked member fights a higher ranked one. If the Pay2Win scenario plays out like we fear, that discrepancy will be even greater. The main problem with GW is troop imbalance & empowered gem converters left,right & center. But that’s another topic.
Also, challenges are NOT a decent thing for end-gamers to work on because the rewards are pitiful for the time it takes to complete them. I stopped on all kingdom but one after Tier III. I’m pretty sure most players are the same. I’d try to get to Tier X today if a decent amount of color deeds were the rewards. I don’t need ingots. I don’t need shards. I don’t need diamonds. I don’t need traitstones. That’s 6 levels of rewards that do nothing for me.

But that’s available to all, and individual. It doesn’t effect you if I have a 50% bonus in a delve, nor does it effect me if you have a 50% bonus in a delve… I don’t get how it effects you if someone else has a kingdom bonus faster than you, or slower than you. It doesn’t matter in the end who gets there first, unless there’s a Power Orb to the person that gets there first.

Well, you certainly do speak about pay 2 win with fear. Do you really feel if I had all 34 kingdoms at level 15 I would wipe the floor with you? I would literally beat everyone else? I just don’t see it being like that. Others would still beat me, I wouldn’t win every guild wars, my guild wars defense would still lose… I just don’t see it as a big deal.

Mostly because I fight teams with way higher stats everyday, and I still win. I lose sometimes, but I win more often than not.

And people are igoring the fact that each kingdom to 15 awards 1 stat boost, so sure in six months, if deeds are common, I’ll have like 6 kingdoms to 15 (unlikely, but maybe), and that would only be 6 additional stat points spread out across 4 stats.

Here’s another pair that would help a lot to move this discussion forward:

  • How many months is it supposed to take a dedicated P2W player to get all kingdoms to upgrade level 15?
  • How many months is it supposed to take a dedicated F2P player to get all kingdoms to upgrade level 15?

If pay 2 win is the term now used to describe the people that help pay Kafka’s salary, does that mean Free to play is the term used to describe everyone else?

It’s basically “players who have an unlimited amount of money to spend” and “players who have zero money to spend”. There are really a lot of terms for those, P2W and F2P seem to be the most common.

One supports the game and one just plays it. Either way, I’m very grateful to those that support the game, and I have zero issues with the Devs getting paid for all their hard work…

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I strongly suspect that the devs only get a monthly salary, not some cash shop related bonus on top. Thanks for sharing your opinion though, as unrelated as it might be to my questions.

It’s not unrelated, because the point is you feel those that support the game (those pay 2 win folks) are getting an advantage over those that simply play the game, (those free to play folks)… and the devs clearly don’t get praised if GOW makes no money, so I think there has to be a balance. You may feel it’s unfair, but I don’t see it that way.

And until we have a flash offer with deeds in it, this is all just speculation.

Sorry, you got it wrong, I think I’m pretty direct whenever I express my feelings one way or another.

It’s also just speculation afterwards, because it doesn’t allow us to know at which frequency the Flash Offer will be repeated or if there will be any other Flash Offers related to deeds. I’m asking the questions to end speculation, we need some facts instead of rumors to work with, and those are of interest to all parties. Note that answering the questions doesn’t reveal any plans about how the intended result is going to be reached (e.g. planned game modes, holiday sales), just how long it is supposed to take, so there shouldn’t be any business conflict in providing that information.

Further speculation, but I’m not sure they even know yet, and price might be a tough one to decide on as well. Like 49.99 offers probably won’t be as popular as 1.99 or 4.99 offers, though 1 deed for 19.99 isn’t going to win over many people either. Even those that support the game, don’t just buy everything because it’s for sale.

I think our best bet is to wait and see how things are until Halloween. By then we will all have a better idea of how common/rare deeds are, and we should also have a better idea of what the flash offers are as well.

I think an even better bet is to just ask, like I did. Then we wouldn’t even have to wait and see if the Flash Offers we bought/didn’t buy were in retrospect a good/bad descision.

Didn’t we go thru this with ingots? People worried about how rare mythic ingots were and how many souls it would take to upgrade commons all the way to mythic? Then we got Delves that give ingots along with other ways to get ingots.

Do not worry about deeds and how rare they are right now. I’m sure the Devs have plans to add ways to get deeds. I think treasure hunt is being reworked isn’t it? They could be adding deeds to treasure hunts. And a goblin that drops deeds. Or a new mode made for collecting deeds.


This thread’s like a circus of bad nerd archetypes.

I go to work and come back to find a guy preaching to all the nerds around him that they’re tryhards who need to get their priorities straight.

“You guys are tryhards.” On an internet gaming forum. Where he has 22k posts (That is more than 5x my volume, thanks.) That wasn’t enough self-parody so he went the extra mile: “Haha sports people memorizing stats.” But wait, he hadn’t finished! After mocking people who memorize things, he accurately named the kingdom from a video game based on a Greek mythological city and even tied a reference to climate change in. I’m speechless.

My dude. To condescend, you have to be above the people you’re addressing.

Then we’ve got this whole, “people who support the game” nonsense, which is precisely why people are opposed to P2W in general. In these posts, the game’s separated into the righteous supporters who put food on Kafka’s table and the lying thieves who want to be given a video game for free. I’d feel sorry except the game has a giant “FREE VIDEO GAME” sign on it. To imply that the people who take that offer are lesser is dishonest, if the devs need more money it takes less than a day to put a price tag on the game.

“AHHHH but if it was a SUBSCRIPTION they’d LOSE” players. Hold up. We just established that only the people who pay in at a certain rate matter. Do you think the devs, in that case, should be upset about losing the freeloaders below the line? This is what’s so damn confusing about the argument. The moment you decide you’re on board with the people who say you are ethically obliged to spend money, they shift gears and tell you the devs are forced by the market to use obfuscated and confusing means to extract money because they’d go out of business if people knew they wanted it.

At least for THIS argument, our Napoleon builds a pedestal for himself and stands on it before condescending. But the first guy’s still whining he’s a tryhard. And probably likes sports. While planning his GW defense teams for next month.

All we’re really missing – and I admit it’s probably here but I am getting it mixed up with a different thread – is the guy who shows up to tell us he already has every deed and maxed every kingdom and it’s really not a big deal.

I wish I had a giant bag of what one has to smoke to make these kinds of posts, because it’s definitely working for you guys and I wouldn’t have to use my own.


IMO it all boils down to how many deeds will be available through AB and how many times they will be offered in a flash offer. We don’t know either of these things yet so it’s a bit early to be calling ptw.

Frequent deeds in AB and rarely in FO no problem.
Rarely in AB and frequent FO is a big problem.

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How many times do we get a FO with an Ascension Orb?
I guess that the FO with Imperial Deeds will be as rare than the Ascension Orb one.

I’d tolerate a faster rate than that for deeds, honestly. Much lower price though.

You “need” 8 total ascension orbs to get a really big prize. It takes a lot more than 8 deeds to max out.

Overall I feel in like with what Fleg’s saying. I don’t know what “frequent” and “rarely” mean. How bothersome flash offers seem depends heavily on how often free offers arrive.

You need 96 Ascension Orbs to get the big prize (i.e. Zuul).
96 is pretty closed than the 102 Imperial Deeds than we need to maximize all kingdoms.

Ah, sorry, I meant the MAJOR Ascension Orb.

For some reason I feel like the normal ones are called “Minor”.

Even if you meant major orbs, you still need 24 of them. It’s eight Orbs of Power. (But this is a minor point against the larger discussion.)