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REDIRECTION from a support reply

If you were pulling from Zul’Kari you were on the right pool. However, keep in mind with such a small number of resources used you could miss the new Legendary troop as that is only 180 Chests.

Edit: Yes I know there will be a poster that says “I only used 1 Event Key and got it.”

I guess (but it’s only my guess) that it was the RNG that screwed you. If it makes you feel better I was using my keys right after reset and had even worse luck. I used over 200 keys and got several Webspinners but no Widow Queens and only 1(!) Tomb Spider. The Tomb Spider proves that I pulled from the right pool but it looks like the RNGsus was in a bad mood for some reason.

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Oh, uh…:flushed::see_no_evil: C-can I blame my vision issues for this? :cold_sweat: Actually I really must have misread this the whole time and I dunno why. I’m gonna hide now…:shushing_face:

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I don’t see any reason why we would ban someone for reporting a bug. I get that there’s a lot of negative community stigma around our development team and claims that we don’t care about our players or ignore bugs: But that is not a sustainable relationship for any live service game dev team. We do what we can given the team and resources we have, and the forums, live stream, and devs in global chat should be proof enough that we are happy to open channels of communication with you.

@OddPoppet Regarding your ticket being closed: I would like you honest feedback on how this process can be better.

The support process now works in a way that if you submit your ticket as something that support can’t help you with - i.e, Request Type is set to Bug Report or Game feedback/questions - then we will send you an email explaining that your ticket has been closed and what you can do to report a bug. Did you get this email?

I find this reply a little pessimistic :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: . It’s up to you as a community if you want to help other players.

I made the decision to change the process to what it is now because I thought it would be better for everyone involved. Again, it’s got nothing to do with the “devs don’t fix bugs/devs don’t listen” stigma. Bug reports are now streamlined to an area devs look at anyway. We’ve removed the middle man and kerfuffle of support in between. We still look at your bug reports on the forums, and now we’ve got more time to help with other request in Technical Support.

@OddPoppet OKAY, now that we’ve covered that, what exactly is your problem? Are you saying that you tried to open chests and didn’t get a legendary? What are you referring to with ‘update’? There hasn’t been any updates in the last few days (where you have to update from app store), only server side weekly reset that happened at 5 pm AEST on Monday.

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Sorry for butting in again, Cyrup; I just want to make sure that my comments in this thread haven’t been misunderstood by you. I never linked the change in bug reports to any such stigma (and don’t feel like it applies at all in this case). I just wished to express that for me, the new system is much worse because I prefer to keep things like screenshots and personal information in some cases from others. For example, I posted a bug here today about sentinels which, to show what happened, needed to display the amount of resources I have (to show they were getting substracted). I am generally not super-happy with that as I have seen cases here on the forum - never applied to me, but still - where people with a lot of gold in their screenshots were immediately publically addressed of why they have so much gold/if they don’t want to join guild X to donate all of it/stuff like that.

At the same time, I feel like I can get less help on the forums. This is for several reasons: The fact that the support form always wished to know things like my level, my invite code, stuff like that, created the subjective feeling that these things are needed; that someone on your end uses them to personally check my account to make sure things are fine.
And, second, the replies I recieved through the support form were always much more extensive and valueable as feedback. They ranged from detailed explanations of why things are the way they are (when I didn’t recieve legendary task rewards when I switched guilds) to “update your drivers and then please get back to me and tell me how things are going” (showing personal interest to see things resolved, even though I just had the game crash on me one single time) to “Hey, that bug is known already, it will be fixed in the next update, thanks for reporting.” Here on the forum, I usually get Salty telling me that the bugs I report will be looked into. And that feels… less satisfying. Salty is a wonderful person, but she’s not support staff, so her handling the response already feels like I haven’t reached support at all. And “we will look into it” is always not very satisfying. If there is a personal ticket going on, it’s easy to keep the personal contact to support, updating new information and being assured there will be a reply back. Here on the forums, that’s not the case, so “we will look into it” in a thread always seems to imply “but don’t expect me to keep you updated, but maybe another player will help you out”.

So basically, I simply feel like the bug reports are not being treated as professionally as before. It is a subjective feeling that might not at all represent the truth, but it’s how I feel. Also the revealing of information in a more pubilc manner is disturbing me. At no point, however, do I feel like you don’t listen.

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Yeah, building off of Sheba and hoping not to derail this thread further: I meant that to be so pessimistic it came off as a joke.

I reported something or the other as a bug the other day knowing full well it was kind of borderline “by design” and wanted to see where it went. An amusing edit war ensued as people fought over what category it belonged in but I think “support” won out. I don’t really remember or care, I was kind of curious to see what other players thought about it and this process is definitely good for those weird “almost bugs”. Kind of like the thread real recently talking about Stealthy mechanics.

I had another paragraph I was typing but it’s time for me to bow out of the thread because I’m obstructing the flow! (Actually maybe you’ll note this edit: a very real problem is players can often be too quick to jump into a thread and insist “it ain’t a bug” and I don’t know a good answer to this “problem” because on many occasions they’re right.)

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Okay, that’s something I didn’t consider so thank you for pointing it out. The email sent from Zendesk should mention that you’re welcome to Private Message Salty, kafka or I if you would prefer to report a bug, but I think I failed to mention that in the forum thread (i’ll go and add that now!).

Ok, I understand, thank you for clarifying. :slight_smile: The issue we had is that it’s been difficult to keep up with the volume of bug reports we receive. And, often, the actual bug reports that we get aren’t things support can action on other than clarifying the issue a little more and saying “we’ll pass that on”. This is essentially what we are still doing with bug reports.

However, the scenario you mentioned (updating drivers etc) is what we would consider a technical issue. That’s something support can help you with and is actually better to submit a ticket for (because, as you say we have access to all your info).

It seems like the issue now is a problem for you guys of working out what qualifies as a bug report vs an anything else (missing something, technical issues). I’ll look into ways I can improve this and perhaps change the Submit a Ticket form to provide clarity around the differences. :+1:

Ahh, text is always ambiguous, my apologies!

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That would indeed be good, as I figured that bugs should be reported here now anyway I never even used Zendesk anymore.

I guess my main problem is that I am not smart enough to see the difference. It might be a language problem, but for me, a bug and a technical issue are… very similiar. Everything on a computer is technical for me, as it’s happening on a piece of technology. Also, I guess it just makes no sense to me because I would be FAR more willing to post something about my drivers on the forum (so what you consider a technical issue), as I find the information about my graphic card far less sensitive than finding an exploit.

Okay, I might somehow see how “technical issue” (= something on my end/my computer sucking) is different from a bug (=something on your end/not working in the game), but “I am missing something, the game didn’t give it to me” is, for me, absolutely a bug because it’s something that the game messed up.
…Am I stupid or something that I cannot see the difference? :confused:

Also this:

Do you remember this thread, Cyrup? THIS is why I don’t like the new system, shown in a perfect, horrible example.
A player - not a newbie, though that was not visible at first - signed up on the forums to report a bug. Before any professional support staff was online to help him (something that doesn’t matter when you send a ticket), players went to comment on the thread, the first one being rude, and then the topic immediately derailed from the issue of the original poster to the members bickering about if it’s an existing bug and how the one poster was rude.

It’s absolutely impossible for someone to find any of this professional or feel like their report gets treated seriously this way when they have to feel like their issue immediately gets shot down and/or forgotten in a myriad of post by other players. It’s not like your dev posts look THAT different from a normal player post; for someone new to the forum, discerning a dev from a normal player might not be immediately doable despite the avatar extra because a lot of people have titles here or fancy avatars. If I were new here, I could think you’re a player who likes Ysabelle and diamonds. If your dev avatars had a special border, you would post in a different color or your posts would immediately be pinned as first post under the bug report so that it’s easy to find them, things would be different. But a newbie doesn’t know all of the support staff, so if ten people reply to their post, the first five are horrible and they don’t wanna check anymore, yours is the eighth and they just see your name in the list of pings, not being able to tell you are a dev (since it just says “Cyrup” there)… they might never see your post in the wall of other posts.

I am not surprised at all the one who made that one thread left and didn’t come back (and said that as feedback).

I honestly feel like bug reports should not allow other forum members to post in the thread before at least someone from your support staff has given feedback to the player about their issue.

Got it!

To be clear, this isn’t a process we are going to change, it’s an implementation that was necessitated. This is a process that other big companies (such as Blizzard!) have in place.

But, I can see that there are problems with it, and there is a lot of room for improvement on our behalf, thanks to your feedback we can act on that now. I’ll focus on making the process of discerning between types of issues as a player clearer, review the process around posting bug reports and allowing other players to provide their input into someone’s report, and define some methods to privately posting vs publicly.

To the OP @OddPoppet feel free to PM me or start a new thread regarding your issue if you feel this topic has derailed.

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eww blizzard :grimacing:

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If I may add one more thing (I’m aware I’m derailing this thread and am sorry about it, but dunno where else to post…): You might also want to review the information you ask about in the bug report form.

There are a ton of players who never use the forum but still enjoy the game a lot - I would guess that this is actually the vast majority. So when then a player signs up here and makes a bug report, likely not even changing their standard avatar since they just want to report the bug and be done with the forum, it automatically screams “Newbie player” at the rest of us.

To come back to the thread I had given as example: It was to both the rude poster and me not visible that the player was a veteran, so the rude poster asked “Do you even know how to play the game?” while I offered newbie advice (“does a troop block the color” and stuff like that) which might also have seen insulting to a veteran, as if I imply that they are indeed too stupid to know the basics. This misundestanding would have not happened to support with the tickets, as there is a field to enter your level, hence making it easier to gauge if it is really something that might be a newbie mistake or an actual issue (kind of like we get the “Casual PVP has crazy difficulty, it’s a bug” sometimes since new players don’t know that the difficulty setting influces Casual PVP).
I feel like asking for the level of players as part of the bug report form is nothing that can do any harm, but might help the playerbase when trying to help out with their answers. If a veteran tells me they have less stats on their troops than the enemies of the same level/ascension, I would treat that more likely as a bug than a newbie reporting this who likely hasn’t leveled his kingdoms yet or isn’t used to legendary task buffs of their guild disappearing with Monday reset.

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I also want to put out that, as detailed in one of my earlier responses, we don’t usually need your personal details for bug reports. Even if you did contact support with your bug, again, we’d just note down some information - as we’re doing now - and pass on the bug. However, if you’re missing something in your game, or you’re having a technical issue for example, then you’d need to contact support… but yes, that comes down to an issue of clarity of when and what to contact about of course!

@Sheba That’s a good point but also crosses issues of privacy again so I’ll discuss that. If there were some restrictions on who posts on another bug report then perhaps so. But then, if it’s a rude comment, it’s going to get moderated anyway… :thinking: Anyhow I’ll see what I can do, if you have further suggestions please PM me so we keep this on topic :+1:

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i find this thread very amusing - and the comment that if you’re missing something contact support even more amusing.

I am not going to say anything more because i will be deliberately misrepresented.

Honestly? Requiring the reporter to do anything else after filing a bug report is redundant. I mean, if you do a Google search for “gems of war support”, you get the Support web site. If you file a ticket on the Support web site, there are categorization options for “Guild Management”, “Account Issue”, “Missing Rewards”, etc., all of which are “non-technical” issues that are being clearly presented as valid reasons to use the Support site.

Your internal process should be invisible to players. If someone uses the Support site to submit a non-technical ticket that the Support staff is no longer capable of dealing with, then they should forward it to someone who can help with non-technical issues. Having someone file a bug report only to be told that they’re doing it wrong, they need to go somewhere else, make an account for a forum, and post/message their report in a specific way or to specific people…is more than 1 step. Bug reporting on the player’s end should just be 1 step - “report the bug”. Everything else beyond that can be as labyrinthine as you like, as long as it’s done internally and it’s not turned back around to be the player’s responsibility.

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Thank you @Amadan, I totally agree.

I would like to add that having to report it here also seems to invite reactions by other players that will offer their opinion on any report. Not always in a positive manner. Knowing this has kept me from reporting the bug I experienced here.

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@Sheba I chuckled at they are not bugs but features. I agree there and its why I laughed.

— Below is a comment not related to the reply above. Just added into the same post.

As a side note they could forward players to the forums. And then instead of saying its this or that thread. It could be a thread named ‘tickets’. And then players making forum accounts and posting would post to a staff only category. And players would only be able to see their thread and the replies made within it if any. This is entirely doable and I really think I’ve seen too much. As I have also seen various software companies do this as well.

Its just an idea if they REALLY want posts made over on the forums. This way if a player wants to keep their anonymity, even if there is no personal information given etc, let them feel its done in private.

Its the same way staff at a hotel will leave a mint on your pillow. Is the mint really needed? Not really? Does it make most of us feel better or happy? For me it does. I like it, even if its simple and cheap. Disposing of ones anonymity even with the negation of personal details still doesn’t give everyone that same feeling. And that’s what companies often look at , the big picture. Pushing players to a openly viewed forum I personally feel was not a good idea. I get honestly why it was done. Still have reservations on how its persists. The aforementioned text even denotes one way they could push it to a hidden category as well.

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One of the major benefits of having bug reports on the forums is that it helps us get a clear idea of how many people are affected by a specific bug. This in addition to streamlining our support which means tickets replied to more quickly. :slight_smile:

Blizzard does a similar thing with how they handle bugs. We know that not everything is smooth yet, but we are doing our best to make this change as seamless as possible. There will likely be some changes in the future as we tweak this process, so please bear with us.

PS, I’ll be updating the Community Guidelines today to reflect some new rules as a result of these changes.

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@Saltypatra Just wanted to add since it was mentioned. Blizzard does indeed have a bug forum, but they also allow you to make a ticket about a bug if you decide to do so. So they let a player decide which they would like to do. Especially considering some bugs can be used to exploit the game. And to have everyone post on the forums, you may also run into the misfortune of someone posting a bug that can be exploited. And before its corrected having many taking advantage of it. Just food for thought. So with that the Blizzard forums or a ticket can be seen as either a optional thing or a preference.

Even some companies who are horrid at times for support (Sony being one of them) also allow for either a ticket being submitted, live chat, calling them, or posting on a forum if they have one and into a category for the product if it exists.

Personally I have not seen a forum only inclusion for bug reporting, until GoW decided it was a sufficient action. And I do know a lot of businesses and/or have engaged a ton of them over my years. So when you look at other companies and how they do bug reports (usually they have a helpdesk or a bug tracker), think of a company then explore the following :

  1. Can a customer make a forum report on the issue … yes/no
  2. Can a customer file a bug report with that business over the phone … yes/no
  3. Can a customer file a bug report and/or get it taken care of with live chat … yes/no
  4. Can a customer submit a bug report via its support email to be handled through emails … yes/no
  5. Can a customer use a helpdesk or bug tracker to file the bug and/or get help … yes/no

Most businesses will have more than 1 of the above available if you poke around. Not simply this is it, now use it.

P.S. I know why GoW decided to do this, honestly I do. So its not lost on me why it happened. I would say that your helpdesk could benefit from tying in a bug tracker system. Which would be far easier and still keeps things private if the user so wishes. Regardless if no personal information is given (see my other post above about why). It may seem silly but I’m sure you are aware yourself businesses do this just to make people more at ease. Even if its truly inconsequential, its the little touches even if they don’t matter, that seemingly matter. Yes people are odd that way. The same way that .99 or .95 sounds better than .00 when deciding a price tag. It doesn’t matter, but people still think its cheaper. Its people after all.

P.S.S. In the end its really what GoW decides what to do that matters. And this chat can be simply discarded without concern.

This is cool and while I think there are problems with having bug reports on the forums, if there’s some indication that people are supposed to behave within and perhaps special rules for Bug Report posts it will solve most of my issues.

To some extent I like seeing them super-visible like this. I’ve been trying to resist “I think this is by design” kind of answers unless I think there’s ample evidence.

I actually also feel like bug reports on the forum make it more likely for bugs to be reported. That’s the good part about it.
Basically, when I found a bug, I always wondered if it would be worth it. One time, my game crashed once(!) when I refreshed casual PVP. The game made an error log and asked to send it to the devs, so I made a ticket. Kafka replied to me, saying the log had been shown to the devs and that I should update my drivers and get back to her and report. And I sat there and was like “:cold_sweat: Ooookay, I cannot reproduce this, the game never crashed again, Kafka has - given the reply speed - obviously a million other reports to handle, the other devs should also have other things to do than look at the report of a one-time crash…”

And so, I kind of stopped reporting these tiny things to zendesk. Like the treasure hunt visible bug I reported here lately which has the game tell you “quest reward Shentang” instead of “Treasure Hunt score” at the end of TH. But here, on the forum, it feels less daunting to report these minor issues because either someone will look at them or not and maybe some players will chime in, too. For these things, the forum bug reports are good.
But for anything more serious that causes real issues in the game, I feel like the forum with all its many users and joking and memes and squabbling and thread derailing is just not the best place. For serious issues, I want them to be handled in a serious environment. And while this forum is lovely, it’s not a very serious place, I feel. No game forum on the internet really is. Humans are humans. (Come on, all I ever post here are bunny gifs. How can this be a serious place?!:rabbit: :wink: )