First of all, I don’t want rewards to get better, but to reach more players, like @efh313 mentioned.
Second, I’d like to make it clear that I probably wouldn’t go for ranked rewards even if they were broader or better. I play about 100+ pvp matches per week, which is probably not even close to bring to me to top 10k.
Lastly, your idea is a bit selfish. “If I’m not gonna get it, I don’t want it to be good for others.”
I’m not sure about @efh313’s suggestion. I honestly don’t know how that would work. I think that maybe it shouldn’t be related to Tier 1, since there are already rewards for Tiers. Maybe extend prizes, small even, for the top 10k players (again, I’ll probably never reach that Rank… this is not a salty comment by someone who thinks they’re entitled to more rewards, I just think it’s fair, considering effort and reward)
I can’t argue against reaching more players as obviously I (might) benefit. I’m not pushing for it either though.
However, nowhere did I say that the current system MUST stand or that because I’m not placing means that it must be good for everyone else and they have to be satisfied with the current system. All I was doing was expressing my satisfaction for how the current system is and to provide perhaps a perspective from “the other side”. So I’d appreciate it if you don’t put words into my mouth.
It’s more a balance than a statistics based approach, in order to get something you usually also have to give something up in return. “Reaching more players” sounds a lot like “moar lootz plx”, they just stretched out ranked rewards a lot, I wouldn’t expect them to do so again. A compromise would be to, say, half all gold gained from ranked battles, put the other half into a pool, distribute the pool based on final rank among all players. That pays the bill, everybody gets something in the end. Those who don’t want to participate can play casual for full gold.
I definitely don’t think they should implement an idea like that. It doesn’t even solve the main issue people have been complaining about which is the lack of access to small arcane rewards.
What you said: You like it because they’re not good enough, since you’re not getting them. If they were better, you’d be sad for not getting. In both cases, you’d get 0. You’ve showed preference for the case in which other people get less. So I’m not putting words into your mouth, I’m just reading between the lines, and that’s part of a normal, healthy discussion. No need to get offended there, I was just showing why I disagree with what you said.
How many people shoot for rank 700, though? If you’re going to try and score some sweet arcane stones, you’re going to be pushing for the highest rank you can. Nobody will stop at rank 990 and say “Yes, this is good. I have done enough grinding”.
Edit: if you aren’t satisfied with the rewards for the highest rank you can achieve, don’t bother trying to play your way into the top 1,000! There are lots of players who do think the rewards are enough for them to play an unhealthy amount.
Slight correction: I didn’t express any “emotion” that I’d be happy or sad whether I got or missed them. All I said was that I don’t feel like I’m missing out. It’s not going to change my gameplay if they are increased and I do feel like I’m missing out; it’s the same why I’m not in a guild with a lot of requirements even though I may be rewarded with tons of guild task rewards.
So while you got this part right
you did proceed to put words in my mouth because you said that I said I don’t want it to be good for others. And if you “read between the lines”, you read incorrectly. That is why I’m offended, not because you disagree with me (or that I disagree with your single point [quote]The reward for achievement Rank 501-1000 (or higher) doesn’t pay the huge effort you need to put in in order to make it into rank 1000+.[/quote])
Liking something involves emotion. It doesn’t have to be true happiness/sadness. And you know that.
Don’t hold on to tiny details like “liking is not being happy about something” (although, yes, it is) to remove focus from the main point. Basically, you have exposed 2 general scenarios (which can be further divided into more, but no need for that for this purpose):
A: You get nothing, other players X.
B: You get nothing, other players get more than X.
You’ve expressed your liking to case A because you’d rather miss out on “X” than miss out on “more than X”. I’m not saying you necessarily prefer case A to case B, but when you express your liking to case A and not to case B, that’s the message you convey. So I stand behind my point above. I shouldn’t have used the word “selfish”, though. That only brought up your defenses.
But I’ll try to repeat this yet again: it’s not about X or “more than X”. It’s about how many people get X.
I can’t be more clearer than I already stated. It was a simple statement that you are choosing to over-analyze and read way too much into it.
But I can address this if you want. Like I said earlier, while I wouldn’t mind “more X”, frankly giving more people X smacks of “participation trophies” in youth sports. Could the number be moved greater than 1000? Maybe. But as someone alluded to/mentioned earlier, it would be nice to get some hard data on where people stop trying to get points or where people stand after getting to Tier 1 to find where that number should be. Maybe 1000 is enough.
I have over 2500 pvp points right now, 600 points over the required for Tier 1 (almost 50% over) and I’m not close to top 10,000, not to mention 1,000. And a lot of people’s already saying that Tier 1 requires a lot of effort. My guild, for instance, is in top 100 (and we’re moving up fast, too) and there’s a good number of people who didn’t even make it to Tier 1 yet.
This has been an interesting debate to say the least. Allow me to throw my opinion in the ring once more.
To respond to this, I have to disagree, participation trophies are for everybody. That is what we receive at the end of the week 500 gold and 50 souls. For EVERYBODY 1000+. However there are large amount of players, myself included that put in the fairly hefty time commitment to make it Tier 1. This is several days of playing for me now, as opposed to the 2 hour rush of the OLD system.
I can confirm that in the two weeks of PvP 2.0, I have reached Tier 1 both times and been rank 15,000+. I am, at this very moment, Tier 1 and Rank 15,695 and that’s with a 74% win rate.
This means that from the Participation level (first Rank reward) to the second level (Ranks 501-1000), you are dropping from 100% to 6.3% and that’s only considering Tier 1 players! Who knows how many pvper’s there are behind me? That is a HUGE reduction in % for the first round of reward for time spent playing.
I think @MakoSipper has a strong argument that more people can be included in the lower rank rewards without it effecting the leaderboards or disrupting the in-game economy.
Maybe that will help to clarify the argument for more players receiving those lower RANK rewards.
My take and response to both of you is that I think you are (erroneously) trying to tie your progress of reaching Tier 1 with how it should reflect on Rank X. You already get tons of rewards for moving up the Tiers. Tier 1 is the “end goal” which everyone can attain, no one can fight for your spot.
Ranking on the other hand, determines your place among all of the GoW players. It uses the same “point system”, probably for convenience, but more reflects the time spent fighting others over and over again. There is probably a huge “clog” in terms of points where people stop at Tier 1 (around the 1900 mark) and everyone spends the same amount of time up to that point but others go on and keep fighting.
So should you get rewarded in the Ranking system merely for reaching Tier 1? Honestly, I believe not. Reaching Tier 1 has its own rewards. Rewarding those putting in the time to play is something different and from the sound of it (and others alluded to), the sheer number of battles being fought to place means those players are getting tons of “rewards” in terms of loot already. But from the looks of it, reaching the higher Ranks is just a journey and the rewards are the icing, but the rewards should not drive or be the reason for the journey.
Nope, wrong, at least from my perspective. A few posts above:
I just think that rewards are for way to few people compared to how many people go over Tier 1. And for most that even get some reward, the prize itself is ridiculously low compared to the insane amount of fighting it requires. But I can say it a fifth time if required.
I don’t think Rank needs to be tweaked at all. It is a totally 100% brand new bonus in every way, and nobody was expecting it. If Rank was suddenly pulled from the game, we would be largely unaffected.
There are a few hard-core players in every game who are hard-core hard-cores. These are the ones who always want more. As soon as a new kingdom is added, they will have it maxed and conquered before bedtime. They are also the ones who spend the most money on games. Now there are 1000 paying slots in the Rank system. Do you think the game makers knew that there are quite a few more players than that? Obviously, Rank was not a democratic attempt to spread some extra resources around. I think it is an attempt to give the hardest-core players more challenge and a thank you. I figured out pretty quickly that Rank is not something I’m going to be playing for (or that 90% of you folks will be playing for.) And I’m fine with that.
When you play a game like GoW, you develop an understanding of what you expect from the game and how it is delivered. Every time there is an update, we go through this same debate as people evaluate how their “contract” has been altered. We usually find some things we like and some we don’t. To me the most important thing is that I not lose something I already had. You can add all kinds of stuff and that’s fine. I was happy with the product before, if you don’t radically change the product I expect, I’ll still be happy.
This posting seems a little short-sighted. What I’m reading is, “hey, there’s a new deal available and I should get some.” I say “no.” If you weren’t expecting it before, by what right can you expect it now? We already get more in terms of an expanded Tier system. If you want the Rank rewards, you should become one of the super-gemmers for whom the new system was apparently designed.
All the same, a little democracy wouldn’t hurt. I don’t think the Ranks need to be changed, but in Rank 0 (the one we will all get) I would like to see the addition of one arcane or runic traitstone.
(Note: if you’ve seen some of my posts, you will note that I’m not happy with the Tier rewards system. Lest you think I’m being hypocritical, let me point out the difference. Tier rewards changes the understanding I had with the game by requiring me to put in more time if I want the same payout. Since the new Rank system is new, it does not affect my agreement with the game one bit as I was not expecting it anyway.)
I understand your point and how you think it doesn’t need any changes. Of course, I agree it doesn’t need changes. They would be nice?
But what most people failed to answer me is this: Do you think it’s worth it going all the way up to Rank 501-1000 for just 500 gold, 50 souls, 1 gem and 1 traitstone? Does it even make any difference for the players who are hardcore enough to get that far?
I think people have failed to answer because the answers are pretty clearly No and No. It’s just a consolation prize for those trying to get the bigger packets of Arcanes but not getting close enough to the top.
Pretty much my thoughts. I see Rank as rewards for only the top 5%. Those guys are so hungry for something extra they’d probably fight just as hard if you halved the reward. That is a level of gaming I can’t really relate to.
@actreal@IronyMan: To me, prizes from below the 50th rank are somewhat consolations. So that’s way less than 5% for me. It’s easier to just gather glory and buy chests in the events. And a lot more rewarding. If you have 15k+ playing somewhat over Tier 1 and you only really intend to reward competition between them for the top guns, it kinda fails as a means of motivating competition for me. Maybe that was their intent, I don’t know.
Anyway, I’ve explained my points, multiple times even, so I think I’ll retire from this thread. I just wanted to share my two cents, but I honestly got tired of this issue. I guess most people who come to this forum want Ranked rewards to completate only the elite players who really don’t need these rewards. I guess I’ll just keep on ignoring pvp points after Tier 1, then. But I still don’t think it’s a good spread of rewards if you want to enoourage people to compete (and I won’t even get into how that would boost their earnings from people who want to P2W…)
