Nerf Dragon's Eye already! (or alternatively, buff all other transform troops)


#163

I mentioned Magnus, that’s the only way to apply cursed at the moment and cursed removes all traits on the troop in question. Otherwise… you simply cheated since you cannot instantly kill Deep Borer, Titan, Gimlet or Highforge with Scorpius since all have immunity to poison. That’s the simple case on that.

Other solutions have been mentioned, lowering the percentage of Dragon’s Eye, not making it work on Dragons, changing the hero into a baby dragon like Dragon Fire does and so on. Yet people are wanting buffs for PvP? What? Oh and, not once or twice but 50 times I’ve gone against it so far with variants but the main one, the dwarf one, is the worst.

Oh and,

I mean, you are acting like it’s “No big deal” when you had insane luck. Face it, if Borealis was changed or you got Wyvern instead, you wouldn’t have won. But nope, go buff all the transform troops, make them all guaranteed since that’s what seems to be your game.


#164

I swear i dont get what are you babbling about, curse, istant kill this or that, you keep babbling about immune troops, need either a translator or an option to not read your… posts.

I said i LOST 1 time to that team only cuz he managed to kill 2 of my GREEN, NOT IMMUNE TO POISON troops almost at start.

Fought same team, still using the same GREEN team both before and after the LOSS and won both times.


#165

Nice trolling. Here we go.

Cursed. This new ability stuns troops that normally would be immune to being stunned along with being diseased. This is how you remove impervious and let them be devoured. Currently Magnus, with his 3rd trait, is the only one who can cause this new status aliment. With me so far? Good.

Fortitude. This trait grants immunity to Stun, Poison, Disease, Death Mark and Devour. With this trait, the troop in question CANNOT be poisoned. Scorpius has an instant kill mechanic if the enemy is poison. It doesn’t instant kill if the enemy isn’t poisoned.

The team you said you used: Titan (DE), Alchemist, Scorpius and Eurlayi vs Deep Borer, Titan (DE), Gimlet Stormbrew and King Highforge. You said your Scorpius managed to instantly kill Gimlet and King Highforge? Without Magnus? Enlighten all of us how that would be possible. Unless the two were changed into baby dragons (which you failed to disclose by the way) then it is impossible otherwise.


#166

Indeed, here we go. You are calling people that does not share your experience for trolls. Superb move!


#167

Please enlighten me how you poison Gimlet or Highforge without them being Cursed. That’s the problem. They are claiming something that’s impossible with the team they used.


#168

You’re correct on all points. I have very keen eyes, and lately I haven’t found any issues with the immunities.
However, the ones that I found, are listed as a bug report.

This Dragon Eye issue, I’ll say it again, can be resolved pretty much easily.

First, at least, give the Hero the transformation immunity when the Champion Level is 100, fully maxed.
However, this could be bypassed if the Stun effect would manage to sneak in, for example, if that immunity was not present or lost. Still, it should count for all the other units, but it should scale to your Level, for example, if your previous card that was transformed, was level 20, then should get a Level 20 Baby Dragon.


#169

This thread is no longer constructive and it’s becoming a space for personal tantrums and attacks.

I think i’ll take my leave.


#170

Go, go, gadget… @Lyya. :grinning:


#171

Long story short: Either nerf Dragon’s Eye or Buff all transformation troops to be 100% like Dragon’s Eye.

Oh and Scorpius cannot instantly kill Gimlet Stormbrew or King Highforge unless both were cursed.


#172

The DE teams are not OP, especially under AI’s commonly stupid operation. The problem is, when they do work it brings huge frustration and ruins players’ experience in PvP, at least part of players.


#173

I understand but be honest and tell me how many time it happen? 1/5? 1/10? Or more? People need to understand it’s not possible to win 100%. If that was the case people would complain the game is too easy.


#174

You could say the same about any “metas” though… People don’t like losing.


#175

I don’t think so. People don’t like losing, but losing to transform is far more frustrated, it’s something like being beaten plus humiliated. As I said in this thread I’m kind of OK about that but I fully understand why people keep ranting about DE but not other things.


#176

What I keep saying and people ignore it to attack straw men:

First, speaking in generalizations is necessary. Yes, there are people out there who have maybe never lost to a DE team. That doesn’t mean there aren’t an awful lot of people who have. So one guy posting two videos doesn’t really prove anything that hasn’t been said. I beat DE teams all the time. But.

How one loses or wins matters a lot.

We (generally) like it if we get a turn 1 or turn 2 win where the AI doesn’t have a chance from the first move. Even the people who don’t like that want to play a game where they have a team with a plan that is executed.

We (generally) don’t like it if the CPU defeats us before turn 4, especially if our defeat comes from a large cascade.

The problem with every team that has been nerfed so far has never been that it was undefeatable. It was always that it was too reliable. For example, the Psion/Rag/Famine/* team was once a menace. It led the developers to create several new immunities to mana drain/burn. Now the team is still powerful, but one can build teams immune to its threat that win more reliably than others.

Could we beat Psion before that? Sure. But it wasn’t fun.

That’s the heart of the argument. DE is “not fun”. It has a relatively low chance of a crushing defeat. But when it does that it’s because it wins dice rolls in a way that is upsetting.

That’s fun if you are the person using DE. That’s why people want to keep it in Delves. There it’s pretty fun. It’s not so fun in PvP (nor are any of the meta teams, for that matter). When it wins it does so in a way that leaves you no options. When it loses, it can be a slog as the 4+ minute video above shows.

There wasn’t a counter for Wisp, and it was nerfed. There wasn’t a counter for Kraken/Mab, and it was nerfed. There wasn’t a counter for Nyxbringer and it not only got 3 separate nerfs, the devs also nerfed the Mana Surge and cluster calculation mechanics specifically to stop it. Divines’ only counter was itself, and 3 troops plus Mana Surge were nerfed.

DE doesn’t have a counter. It deserves a place amongst the other teams that weren’t fun to face. But the nerf isn’t going to be simple, because it’s cool on offense and I think even the people that’d like to see a nerf don’t want to lose that.

This is not a simple problem that will require a minor adjustment. It’s also not a case of people wanting a 100% win ratio, no matter how hard you try to steer the conversation that way.

It’s about wanting to lose to teams that make you feel like you made some bad decisions and could’ve won if you got another chance. AKA we’d like the illusion that these games aren’t decided by luck, and we hate teams that break the illusion.

DE is analogous to Goblins in that respect. Goblins is easy to beat, but every now and then you get that one perfect Goblins board that lets them destroy you on their first move. The argument is and always has been DE gets “that perfect board” a little too often.


#177

Good points, you could make an argument going by your post, that a very subtle change could be made for Dragon’s Eye for PVP only. Take Honor (Honour) - +10 to all skills in PVP - its already there.

I don’t know how simple this could be, but the DE was never designed to be like it is. It was a gimmick kind of thing acquired from class wins for Dragonguard and I have used it in Dragon teams. It was rubbish. Since the advent of the class traits, it now is quite the thing with barrier, exploding gems on 4 gem matches and refilling itself when it casts, to name just a couple of things that exacerbate the ‘bad feeling’ with it.

The advent of TPK for example with Titan (and there’s another troop coming soon that can explode a gem by matching gems) adds further grief potential.

A simple solution would be to make it 1 cast only or a % chance of transform in PVP and leave it alone for everywhere else, aka Delve. It has already been neutered there and everywhere else.

Something like ‘If in PVP battle, transform one random enemy into a Baby Dragon’ - otherwise transform a random enemy into a Baby Dragon’.

That will not effect Delves any further, it won’t bring in more mass market invulnerable yet and it will become less likely to be a viable troop in PVP - other than for griefing alongside Lust, JOE, Bandit spawns et al.


#178

Gotta apologize to you, didnt kno w about your medical situation.

I said i used what?

I said i was using a GREEN team, to be more precise for those that dont know color difference was AURAI, FOREST GUARDIAN,GIANT SPIDER and ALDERFATHER.

ENEMY team was TITAN DE, ALCHEMIST, SCORPIUS and ERIUALY.

But as said, sorry, keep talking about your imaginary dwarf army togheter with other ppls with really keen eyes.

Last thing i can add is, where are “all those ppls” that cry about DE? cuz in that thread i see like what? maybe 5 ppls, but a lot noisy and that spend more time on forum than game, that cry about it when there are THOUSANDS ppls in game that do pvp and never seen anything about it in global either.


#179

I have started a poll so people can state their preferences for what (if anything) should be done with Dragon’s Eye.

Note that the new thread is only for choosing a preference, please keep all other discussions about it in this thread, thank you.


#180

i agree that dragon eye teams are a pain to beat but instead of thinking a way to kill the weapon why not find a counter team to defeat it?


#181

There are teams that can (with a bit of luck) beat it. But they rather rely on being a very late / end-game player who has the right Troops and Weapons…


#182

I, like many other, avoid it.
Because losing to it is frustrating, and winning is not fun either.
A large part of the fun of GOW is team building, and winning with said team.
So winning a long battle with random dragons that have no relation to my starting team is not fun.

That is why it’s an issue. Not because it’s unbeatable. But because it reduces fun.
Fun and, to a point, challenge, are the flames that keep games alive, and they must be protected.

Since launch, there as never been a point when I avoid so many adversaries (I currently avoid Skelton Keys, Dragon Eye and Yao-Gai).
I can beat them just fine with specific teams, but I can’t deny their 1 trick pony aspect that make them suddenly go crazy and kill you with a blink.

Believe me, the devs know about DE and are looking into it, because they know how bad frustration is for a game.