@ogunther No need to be offended. I was upset by don being called out and it got my hackles up. I have had a moment to breathe and I’m done playing devils advocate. I don’t do it because I am too good at pushing buttons.
You know you are my favorite tree to love to hate! 
I’m sorry for upsetting you and anybody else. As I stated above nothing was done with an intention of cheating and mean Machine will not be pursuing this course any further.
Much love to GW, GoW, and my Forum family!
It sounds like we mostly agree but I would like to make sure one point is clear and that is that Hoguns hasn’t “profited” from any form of exploit that “raked in rewards”. The 1-troop defense definitely doesn’t do that and Hoguns never exploited the old task system back when that was a thing (we weren’t even organized enough to do that even if we’d wanted to, which we didn’t…but I still don’t think those things are comparable regardless).
I appreciate the sentiment, @efh313 and accept your apology. I can understand wanting to defend @DonBoba and your guild, so I sympathize. Like I said originally, I don’t blame MM for attempting to go that route even though I myself don’t approve of it (I’m also not in charge of GoW lol so what I approve or disapprove of doesn’t really matter anyway), I blame the devs for not stepping up and giving the community a straightforward answer. That’s the real culprit here.
You and I do disagree on what your “intent” seems to have been, but again, that’s neither here nor there. If the devs had given a clear answer, then all of this back and forth would be moot (one way or the other).
I am really not, i don’t think they are valid, as a matter of fact i was the first to ask for the offering guild to be revealed, after Asha denied that and Don came out and revealed it himself i was admittedly a bit taken with it. I do absolutely think he had a grave error in judgement but at least he owned up to it.
By no means do i think colluding in GW should be a thing, quite the opposite, and if the Devs do something to punish this kind of behaviour i’ll be all for it.
So far though there is no evidence whatsoever on any form of ímpact colluding had on guild wars outcomes yet. On the other hand other shady practices in the past had very distinctive impact on the trophy leaderboards and the reward gain of people and the outrage was nowhere near what this is now, i am just wondering about that.
I think it’s the word “would” there that was the point of contention for me in your previous statement. I agree that we are on the same side. But it doesn’t remain to be seen if it “would.” It definitely would. It remains to be seen if people are currently doing that, sure. But the numbers don’t lie about that fact that it “would” rob other guilds of rewards.
I honestly think this is due to the level of rewards. Top rewards for weekly PVP are meh. Sure, people were mad, and accountsharing/botting is unfair and not a good thing, but the level of rewards is much higher for guilds in this case. Thus, the outrage.
edit kept thinking about this: it’s also because if a singular person loses out on say top100 PVP rewards…it’s…not as rage inducing as it is for these guild leaders who feel responsible for 29 other players. They are all acting “voices” for their group, and not just for themselves. So a lot more passion goes into this, and with passion comes forum posts like these.
Life threw me one hell of a curveball, and I’ve been taking a break from the game. I hope to return eventually, but I also hope GW is completely “problem-free” before I do. I’m one of those long-time players I spoke about, and sometimes it’s hard to see something as good when it comes with change. We’ll see, that story is still being written.
Miss you all too man, and hope everyone is doing well. 
I’m sending you good vibes and hope that whatever curveball was thrown at you, that you knock it out of the park. Sometimes life sucks, but sometimes it also only seems to suck right before it gets better. Here’s hoping in your case it’s the latter.
I can only speak for myself, but this is definitely true. I have an amazing guild and feel that part of my job as leader is to ensure that their voice is heard here on the forums even when they aren’t here representing themselves.
I really don’t have any interest in wading into this argument, but I’d like to share my thoughts, since it’s likely the devs are paying attention to the feedback in this thread.
Regardless of whether or not it’s technically cheating, I feel that win trading in Guild Wars is pretty poor sportsmanship and dilutes the potential fun of this new mode. I encourage the devs to take a clearer stand on the issue, and make changes to the system to prevent it.
Completely off topic so please forgive me but I always think you’re @Nimhain for a second since she used that profile picture for awhile lol.
That’s the second time someone said that. I just like the art, but maybe I should change it. Really, I’m not trying to pose as a dev! 
Nah, I didn’t think you were and honestly, she changes her picture I think every time a new kingdom comes out so if no one could use the troops she used to use, that start being a lot of troops off limits. I doubt she’d want that either. Mostly I just laugh at myself when I make that mistake. 
[quote=“Gouki, post:172, topic:23674, full:true”] On the other hand other shady practices in the past had very distinctive impact on the trophy leaderboards and the reward gain of people and the outrage was nowhere near what this is now, i am just wondering about that.
[/quote]
Not sure if you sincerely don’t understand the outrage, or just keep stating this for effect. But assuming it really isn’t clear, it’s about magnitude. PvP gives 1 player 50 gems for upwards of 70 hours of play. GW gives the top guild 1500 gems per player for (generously) 10 hours of play. So the rewards are almost 200x greater, and the reduction in time spent makes the pool going after those rewards much greater. It’s like the difference between somebody stealing your car keys compared to the actual car, and one isn’t more illegal, but the effects are definitely more painful.
If you have said in which guild you are, sorry I don’t remember. But these 1500 gems have cost several hours a day of building and testing teams and helping each other to many of my guildmates.
The pool going after those rewards is maybe great, but being in bracket 1 is not a leisure cruise. It is tough.
It is only a detail and doesn’t change anything to your reasoning, but it seems to me important to put things in perspective.
I didn’t say specifically in this thread, but I’m in Hoguns, so bracket 2 the previous couple weeks. You do have to spend a lot of time figuring out teams, but a lot of that is “sunk costs” that doesn’t need to be done every week. And you also spread that time around lots of players. We have some players that spend a lot of time each day, some that spend a minimal amount of time planning teams, and then a good number of people just seem to use everybody else’s findings. So averaging out the time among all 30 members reduces it quite a bit. But it’s definitely a valid point that testing is necessary and not free.
With all that said, at 200x the rewards, all 30 players could spend 24 hours a day testing teams, and it would still be more profitable. So the difference between GW and PvP is so drastic that it should be self evident, in my opinion.
Devs took their position about alliance: they tolerate it for the moment.
Like account sharing! Some players on this forum don’t care about what devs said and continue to call them cheaters…
But what is an exploit or cheating are defined by devs. Not by a tiny and non-representative set of players.
I just don’t like all this over-reaction about @DonBoba when he did nothing illegal. You can disagree but not insult other players for something that you consider illegal.
That’s the thing… I can’t play the same game I played a month ago. Things have changed. Truly, I’m not sure I like the direction things are going. Of course, it’s always possible that the devs will re-examine their stance on the two guild collusion exploit. Who knows. All I know right now is that I’m pissed, frustrated and disappointed. I have zero desire to play right now.
Maybe I’ll come back after being away from it for a month or two and find a guild that doesn’t care about GW. I wouldn’t touch GW with a 10-foot pole while they openly allow people to get an advantage with unethical behind the scene deals.
RE: Don and Mean Machine:
Since there seems to be a misunderstanding about this, I just want to make it crystal clear I did not leave because of Don’s offer. That had nothing to do with it. I finally made the decision to leave after being on the fence about leaving for months. I’m in the end game. I was so extremely tired of grinding the same stale meta that appears in end game. Deckbuilding is pointless in the end game. I can steamroll over any defense in PVP without much thought. I’m sure this is true of anyone in the end game.
So, Guild Wars was my last hope of having both an on-the-level, competitive mode and a mode that gave me the chance to finally have the challenge of deck building. Despite all the bugs and drama, the first week seemed promising. Then, the second week showed the actual cracks. Most people in the bracket set the same RNG instakill/devour defenses just to squeak out a win. (Myself included.) So, we were right back to the exact same tedious problem of endgame PVP. But now, the problem is 10 times worse because the stakes are much higher.
Now, stacked on top of all of that, I come to the forum and see the dev’s response to this thread. For me, that was the last straw on the straw mountain.
I think, until the devs come out and say that any specific behaviour is illegal, be it botting (which they have), account sharing (which they haven’t), alliances in GW, setting one troop defences in pvp or anything else, then anything that isn’t illegal will be considered fair game.
Whether one’s opinion about it being ethical, in the spirit of the game or otherwise, is exactly that, a personal opinion. Some will agree, others won’t and that’s what happens in a world where people of different backgrounds, beliefs and opinion live.
I should caveat by saying that I’m not expressing any agreement or disagreement with what anyone else said here, just my opinions.