Easier fights shouldn’t get the same rewards as harder fights.
Why is that so hard to understand?
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Attacking someone personally instead of their argument is sure fire proof YOU have lost said argument.
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there is difference between “the base difficulty of task alone” and the “players ability” which makes the taken difficulty to become harder or easier for them.
reward should be appropriate to the base difficuty of the given task, and despite how hard it is for said player all should be rewarded equally upon completing them
take school grades for example:
one struggles to do the task and one will breeze through it, but all will get the marsk accordingly to the result of that exact same task depending on the result, not their personal struggles towards it (same base difficulty for all, but different personal difficulty)
if a low level school kid wants to do a medicine study exam he will get the reward according to the result, regardless of the personal difficulty of his struggle
if his result is same as result of an adult teacher who wanted to do extra studies they will get same reward = same grades
thats life, thats fair and there is nothign wrong with making it the same way in game
only small children need a reward according to their effort and not to according to actual task base difficulty - to motivate them to develop themseves for incoming life tasks
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i don’t agree much but i see the upside of it. people will less likely to “exploit” because they have no control.
but the cascading effect would be more grief team emerging, because why not? why should they make it easier for for other people when others don’t make it easier for them? one of the reason stopping them now is they have some control of who they fight.
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Low level players are the ‘small children’ in this game as they have far less tools/resources at their disposal. The extra gold received is designed to motivate and assist them into developing their kingdoms.
Low level players are not on an even playing field when compared to higher levels.
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The ‘base difficulty’ as you call it is not the same for both players though. What is easier? matching skulls 3 times or 5 times? Casting a spell 2 times or 4 times? Because that is the difference in base difficulty for a mid level player vs an end game player.
As you said, the effort put forth should be proportional to the reward. And mid game players face a more difficult challenge than end game players and thus should get more rewards.
i dont see a readon why pvp teams should be purposedly constructed weaker?
its pvp, if ppl wanted easier team compositions they have other game modes that dont fight against player teams xD
every game i remmember when you create a pvp defense it is suppose to be the hardest you can make
i dont see the problem with teams being intentionally constructed hard and griefing
the problem is with amount of combinations of said hard/griefing defenses at the highest teamscore levels
and the problem is with some troops that are too outstandingly griefing
also i offered a choice to fight weaker teams with qweaker teams which ofc opens more variety
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No the only thing it is “sure fire proof” of is that i have no desire to have the argument
If you say that water freezes at 212 degrees Fahrenheit and i call you an idiot in response that doesnt somehow magically make water freeze at 212 F now does it?
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Bahaha - so you still think directly insulting people is fine…
Go figure.
the low level players would loose nothing in my proposition, they keep their high rewards when fighting high score enemies
depends how the gold is calculated they might even gain more then now
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Then once they get to the end game and start getting diminishing returns compared to what they used to get, they will be in the same position as you, asking for the bonus they used to get, even though they no longer meet the conditions to earn that bonus.
I think there is a lot to be said to reward the same amount of gold for defeating the same team (including stats), regardless of your attacking team and its stats.
You already get more gold per minute if you are faster doing it (which is typically so when your team is better). So the gold per fight need not depend on your attacking teamscore, just on the defending teamscore.
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No not ppl in general… Just idiots
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another example why you are wrong:
non-pvp game difficulty
the game difficulty is the “base dificulty” i am talking about (same bonus gold/souls depending on set base difficulty)
the reward for said difficulty is the same regardless of player level and of their personal struggle towards it
so for high levels beating the highest game difficulties while it is easier to them gives them the same reward as to low levels who try to do it.
thats how it is and thats how it should be
they only tried a different method with pvp gold calculation “to not flood the market” with too much gold, but i think with the current pvp issues that is not a good solution to keep
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And this is where I call bullshit !
Endgame players have spend considerably more effort to get where they are than midgame players, and you’re advocating endgame players should get fewer rewards for fighting the same opponent as midgame players. Essentially you’re advocating that endgame players should be penalized for their effort.
But you’re saying that “effort should be proportional to the reward”, right? I could reverse the argument here and say that endgame players have spent much more effort on the game and consequently should get more rewards for every battle they fight, but that’s not the point here.
Fighting the same opponent should bring everyone the same rewards. It is really that simple. Otherwise all you do is penalize the group of players that has spent the most effort on the game. And effort is what it is, according to you, all about, right?
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if they wanted a “boost” to low levels who need to level the kingdoms they could make a flat:
+300 pvp gold per fight until lv250
or something like that, not a dynamic change of rewards depending on player development (that starts removing the bonus at late game, not at mid-game, the mid-game is when you are done with kingdom levels anyway, punishing just late game alone is silly)
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Here’s the thing though, they have already received those extra rewards for that extra effort. And now that their effort is lower now, they should receive less now.[quote=“Darkness, post:418, topic:24808”]
Fighting the same opponent should bring everyone the same rewards. It is really that simple. Otherwise all you do is penalize the group of players that has spent the most effort on the game. And effort is what it is, according to you, all about, right?
[/quote]
No fighting a more difficult opponent should reward more than fighting an evenly matched opponent. If you want to frame it as a penalty to evenly matched players rather than in incentive for lower power level players to fight a more difficult opponent I can’t stop you. It is the same coin just different sides. [quote=“Annaerith, post:417, topic:24808”]
non-pvp game difficulty
the game difficulty is the “base dificulty” i am talking about (same bonus gold/souls depending on set base difficulty)
the reward for said difficulty is the same regardless of player level and of their personal struggle towards it
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Again you are wrong. consider this. We both start at normal. Easy peasy right? Now we both increase the difficulty until the enemy has the same average stats as us. I get to warlord 1, you get to warlord 3. This is the ‘base difficulty’. You are getting more rewards for an even fight than I am. How is that fair? Should I bump my difficulty up to warlord 3 I will now be getting bonus rewards for a more difficult fight. This is how it is in pvp. [quote=“Kharybdys, post:415, topic:24808”]
You already get more gold per minute if you are faster doing it (which is typically so when your team is better). So the gold per fight need not depend on your attacking teamscore, just on the defending teamscore
[/quote]
This right here. Against the same end game defense, you can defeat 2-3 times It takes a mid game player to win once. Your bonus is doing it more often in the same amount of time and this is why your income needs to be cut in half.
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base difficulty its cataloguing enemy by their stats - its objective and so its done before you even have/speak of a player who will fight them, you can get one catalogue list of difficulties with their “priced” rewards for each difficulty that applies exactly same to everyone
non-pvp catalogue, enemy faced:
normal = set of x stats of all quests etc
hard = set of 125% of x stats on all quests etc
etc…
example of pvp base difficulty catalogue, enemy faced:
easy = 0-1k teamscore stats
normal = 1-2k teamscore stats
medium = 3k-4k teamscore stats
hard = 5-6k teamscore stats
very hard = 7-8k teamscore stats
hell = 9k+ teamscore stats
personal difficulty is actually how hard that enemy stats are to the player and so it is subjective - depends on the subject who will fight them
example of subjective difficulty catalogue:
easy = lower then your teamscore by more then 500 points
normal = around your teamscore with +/- 500 points difference
hard = higher then your teamscore by 500+ to 2000 points
hell = higher then your teamscore by more then 2000 points
you are stubborn to use a subjective difficulty classification instead of objective one which i think is unfair coz :
- it doesnt reward player development which is the essence of the game, instead it punishes for it
currently, gold reward = [ personal difficulty] & [account level bonus]
you may not realise but in practice it works like this:
- new player = doesnt get the bonus gold for high difficulty coz they cannot beat them (bad, fails to help the players the way you wanted)
- low level player = starts gettign the bonus and is using it to level kingdoms (good, helps the way you wanted)
- mid game player = they just finished leveling the kingdoms and are working on their kingdom power, they still get the gold bonus but even higher (bad, it wasnt suppose to help those players, they are done with their kngdoms)
- late/mid game player = they are almost the end game but still 2k to 1k team score below, done with most of kingdoms and at least long time done with the kingdoms that mattered most and with most of needed traits, they _are still getting the bonu_s, the gold bonus is lower but still present. they are able to perfectly win and the fights are as easy to them as to the actual end gamers (bad, it wasnt suppose to reward them according to your idea)
- end game player = they reqach the peak of teamscore and are getting no bonus but just base gold according to their account level, they alone are punished most heavily (thats good according to your idea but completely unfair to compare to all other groups)
can you see the error?
your system that suppose to help ppl leveling kingdoms should have ended the bonus much eaarlier, and it also should not punish the end gamers in comparison to the late/mid gamers
adn if you say you dont actually wanna help low levels, but you wanna revard the personal difficulty let me tell you this:
it is unfair to disallow a player to take harder fight with harder rewards when other players are still qallowed to do so. and thats what it is currently done to end gamers
the system would be fine if it artificially incresed stats of 3 trophy fights for those at peak teamscore levels so they could have gold recalculated accordingly as well
but since it doesnt its a punishment
i offered a system that doesnt pounish anyone.
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The issue with this is the rich get even richer, due to being able to complete battles faster the further you progress in the game.
When devs reduced rewards from guild tasks (change from keys and gems, to what we have now) the disparity between the rich and poor guilds was presented as a reason.
The rewards are meant to be for time spent battling, rather than for each individual battle.
Understand?
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i dont think the end gamers spend less time then mid/late gamers to defeat said 9k team. (the damage increase - ability to kill faster - ends much earlier then the team score points that still grows with life and armor stats)
also i dont think the mid gamers (the ones with kingdoms lv10 but not much kingdom power) spend proportionately more time to defeat said 9k team then the mid/late or end game players in proportion to the gold given
i think they are spending less time then the bonus gold they get (something like 2x more rewards for only 25% more time spent)
plus if it was console, you could throw the whole theory about rewarding time spent outa the window due to their ai beign able to loop into oblivion (im not talkign about cascades but correctly set gem sliders to aid correct gem creators)
also to be clear:
im not saying all that coz i reached the point of end game and are being punished, no
i knew system punishes for high acc developemnt so i simply made sure ill stay in the late/mid game and have fun. so yeah im having more pvp variety, enjoy sensible gold rewards for the time spent with a sensible pvp difficulty
the quick fix for 4troop team didnt even hurt me at all
i just believe that ppl who played the game in a classic, intuitive way should not be punished for going all the way into it. it is unfair, its like devs cheated them without sayign the catch. but the catch is there clearly
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