Yeah… That’s also true…
Blame the shitty boards… Not the OP weapons. If there wasn’t so many crap weapons then the good ones wouldn’t seem so powerful.
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Who doesn’t like a good challenge,and part of the challenge in this game is coming up with a team to properly counter another. I don’t always beat the rope dart team but I do more often than not and I have 2 or 3 good counters to beat it that will win 75% of the time. I think the weapon itself has a lot going for it,even more so than dawnbringer which takes the most resources to get,and is a mythic weapon so that puzzles me why rope dart is so much better. I don’t own rope dart because I was taking a break at the time it was released, however I rarely,if ever run a meta team on defense any way. Blame the community for always having a copy and paste defense without being original.
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I think what’s happened to Dragon Eye is a wake up call to anyone protesting and demanding nerfs to weapons and troops left right and centre. Dragon Eye hasn’t been nerfed…he has been castrated. The devs are probably so sick of people complaining that subsequent nerfs may be similarly brutal. As people have said, these teams can be beat although it can be a tougher proposition in wars as opposed to pvp. The increased number of empowered troops getting thrown at the game is the real issue in my opinion. They are the catalysts which make teams like rope dart so fast and so destructive.
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As mentioned, the primary problem right now is the deluge of Empowered troops. Rope Dart by itself of fairly potent but, in conjunction with an Empowered troop set up, it becomes a true menace for many players. Rope Dart is quite enjoyable to use on offense/attack teams. However, I would hate to see it get nerfed because of the pain it has become on defense teams. Rope Dart is a microcosm of a much larger issue. It gets copied on defense because of it’s effectiveness like Dragons Eye before it, like Divine teams before that, like Kraken teams before that etc. These teams get copied ad nauseam to where the player base calls, somewhat justifiably, for nerfs.
Should Rope Dart get nerfed, something will take it’s place. The replacement will get nerfed only to be replaced by something else. And on it goes.
Perhaps the developers should go after the root of the problem. Perhaps a solution could be incentives to players for using non-Meta troops/weapons on their defense teams. Or perhaps the developers should eliminate keeping defense win/loss records for players or not have defense victories factor into scoring for PvP leaderboards - only have Attack victories count. Abolishing win/loss defense tallies would eliminate the ego need a player might have to field a grief defense team like a Rope Dart team. Getting rid of defense wins/losses counting towards PvP leaderboards would further reduce the incentive. I don’t know if either of those suggestions would work but they do go at the root of the issue. We would still see those teams in GW but, to be fair, we all should have to face the best of the best our opponents have to offer in GW.
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Don’t touch rope dart, the weapon is balanced and useful also in PvE and events, don’t ruin it cause have one good meta in PvP.
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Once again the problem isin’t the weapon but the variety. And again my suggestion isin’t a nerf but a change in pvp. We really need to be able to set 3 differents defenses (no duplicate team) you can use 4x same troop in the same team but you can’t pick it for your 2 other team and when someone is fighting against you, it will select a random defense between your 3 defense team.
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That is a really cool idea that I had not thought of before. Repeated troops on one team but no repeated troops between teams.
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No.
Every. Single. Nerf. Thread. Boils down to something that is too powerful when it loops. Wisp. Kraken. Fizzbang. All six teams that had Mab but we nerfed Dawnbringer, Kraken a second time, every troll, every exploder, Nyx, and how mana is calculated for clusters instead of Mab. Ubastet. Ishbaala. Dragon’s Eye. Now Rope Dart. People want a Skeleton Key nerf, too.
Every. Single. Strat. Relies. On. Free. Turns. The only ones that work can reliably loop multiple free turns in a row.
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Enough on nerfing weapons! Rope Dart is so useful in so many other battles but PvP. Think hard how to neutralize it instead of crying. Essence of Evil takes care of it easily. I stopped losing to Rabbit/Dart teams with EoE.
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If a particular defense team is getting way way above average defense wins it needs to be nerfed. Not because of people whinging but because every 2nd battle in pvp ends up being that team. Remember not that long ago nearly every pvp battle was vs Divines? It’s simply boring and annoying as hell doing pvp once a certain meta takes over.
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And yet it’s beatable. And to have the powerful weapon nerfed because of the meta team is too much. Here’s me a second ago, pretty beatable.
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The devs of course have not chimed in at all!!!. Probably too busy in global chat.
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I think the problem here is that there is a bit of strawmanning of the arguments here. Unless someone has a very incomplete collection of troops and weapons, few would say the team is entirely unbeatable. I don’t think it’s mutually exclusive to say that it is beatable, but it is used too often. I agree the honor system should have been used to reward clever team design and punish lazy team design (unless it is for event purposes).
The thing is, heroes are now the strongest troop in essence as not only have some great weapons come out, but the talents and new classes make them quite the handful to deal with. As a result, most defenses will have said hero, as it is an optimal move if it is to disrupt the other players. To this goal, the best hero weapons will do generally speaking, one of two things. It will end the fight quickly, often creating a loop, or it will prolong the fight, sometimes indefinitely. Rope dart, divine protector, and flammifer are great examples of the former, and weapons like Jar of eyes and Guardian crown are powerful defensive weapons that are powerful weapons of attrition.
Other than a potential loss of “honor”, there has been no change to defense incentives, and as such, the teams are still more often than naught, designed to be a nuisance. To combat these defenses, you need an equally, if not stronger weapon since some teams are difficult to counter fully. While weapons like rope dart and essence of evil are great on offense, we all know how irritating it can be on defense. EoE literally can refill itself while rendering a majority of troops useless in one cast, and the rest only need a second, unless the frog transformation effect triggered. It is an amazingly broken weapon given the Jack o lantern weapon exists, and has great upgrades to boot. The problem is, since weapons don’t change their effects based on attacking or defending, if we nerf rope dart, or EoE, or flammifer, we lose out on another attack option.
This game’s power creep is like a rolling snowball down a mountain, constantly growing out of control in a comical faction, but we are the butt of the joke. Adding more empowered converters, exploders, and mana drainers will not fix the problem, but exasperate it. With potions (and the rare good event troop), guild and other events have gotten easier to do. With GW, other than cleansers and better counters, some days will be hell until we get a proper fix. For PVP, it need s a real overhaul of defense rewards to promote either creative team builds, or beneficial team builds instead of teams designed to frustrate. However, given their “fix” for Dragon’s eye which created that whole mess because of delves, I think I have a better chance of winning the jackpot in the lottery.
TLDR: Changing the incentive structure would be far more effective than nerfing, as most weapons on the nerf chopping block are used mostly, if not, mainly on offense, and people will just look for the next broken thing for defense anyway.
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exactly how i feel but didnt know how to put nicely into words. 100% agree.
I think people are talking about 2 different things. If you are talking pvp match who cares. Retreat or skip it or what ever. The thing I think people are actually talking about is guild Wars. I want Def to be hard. I like a challenge but it appears some do not. I think I beat at least 10 rope dart teams in guild wars and lost no battles. I also faced DEF harder than rope dart and those went down too. Everyone has 100’s of troops and weapons and if they look hard enough there is a team for every Def. I think lots of people think they should use their same blue attack team on every blue day DEF and they should win 100% of the time or a NERF is in order.
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That’s a good point, was dragon eye the problem or the empowered Gimlett Stormbrew? How about the Flamminger/Yao Guai/Queen Titania team, is the problem the empowered Tai Pan, is Rope Dart the problem or the empowered Moon Rabbit? There seems to be a running theme here…
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What to start with?
Before crying “NERF!!!”, please, keep one thing in mind - be careful what you wish for, you might just get it. Look no further than Dragon Eye: I agree that it needed some slight adjustment (namely, tinkering with mana generation part) but what we got instead was, essentially, a butchery. Those who want to start these nerf-it threads should offer their reasonable suggestions on how to fix the problem in their very first post; simple pitch-fork shaking is not the best way to go.
Just as other have already mentioned, the most important aspect of Rope Dart issue is eternal loop cycle and not the weapon itself. I suggest you try using Rope Dart in a team without any loop potential and then see how overpowered it actually is.
Also, nerfing-this-and-that is not a solution to laziness - players being too lazy to come up with anything but meta defence (I, for example, set up new defence team every Monday trying to make something from weekly bonus troops) and players being too lazy to use more than one offence team (again, I currently float between five regular offence teams with other testing teams thrown in between).
One loss to Infernus, one loss to Yao, one loss to a very interesting team with Orbweaver and eternal Giant Spider summons (I would’ve given all five honour points to this guy if I could!) and an entire one loss to a Rope Dart…always going for 3T choice (unless revenge battle involved).
And can I ask where do you get this ‘every battle is a Rope Dart’ notion form? I don’t feel I see that much of them.
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You are right, we need be carefull with these nerfs, dragon eye is almost useless now.
I find the answer « look at what happened to Dragon Eye » hilarious.
It’s gone. That’s what happened. It’s gone, I don’t miss it, and PvP is better for it. Does anyone actually miss fighting it??
So more nerfs to troops that make the game broken, thanks.
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