[Reported] Underspire: Endless corridor

I may be overly cautious but that just left a sour taste - it couldn’t go on as it was because certain combinations (was it 1,2,3,4?) could never result in a perfect run. So in that sense I get it.

But the comment on this thread about how it’s unfair that some people have figured it out and others haven’t and the hint that that may need changing is basically the same thing. “cool, you figured it out, now we’ll change it”

Difference is that the only thing they need to change is that paths can be extremely long. There shouldn’t be 10,15,20 or more rooms in a row.

But if they leave it as is, people who pay attention can still figure it out without being told.

No one has better chances because of some tools, or no chances if they don’t know that a certain combination doesn’t work.

Worst case here is that they run into a dead end.

Only thing needed is that paths need a room limit.

(Spelling this out not necessarily for you but for whoever of the cx team or maybe devs reads this).

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CX people report to the devs. So even if none of them at least skim over the forum, it’s still giving info to the devs via cx.

So hiding info from cx hides it from the devs, too, right?

And there are good reasons for keeping some things to ourselves (the players, not everyone to themselves).

Yes so we’re on the same page. Fourdottwoone seemed to imply we’re not hiding it from the CX staff, and that it didn’t matter what Kafka or any CX may see or not.

I think what 4.21 meant to say is that Kafka or anyone else may not have the same incentive reporting things from a separate source like a discord server.

Not sure, though, and not sure if that’s the case either.

And guild war score breakdowns.

I’m still catching up in here but the information as promised:

From reset today, dead ends in Underspire will not be longer than 6 tiles.
This is the way it was always intended to work - there was a bug which meant that a dead end could try to fill the entire map.

There are changes coming to Underspire in a future update which will see this number changed again - the details will be in the patch notes for the update those changes are in.

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is this the only change? no other unexpected changes?

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So long as that is the only change, good, as for the future changes, i would hope there would be less branches in general, or an easier way to identify correct paths somehow, as i had the MOST unlucky underspire out of the ones weve had so far, i normally finish around 90-100 rooms, but this one took nearly 130… thats an extra like 600 gems over what it was costing me on average. Please give us info on what those future changes might be as soon as you possibly can.

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I know everyone is discussing CX finding game guides being bad for players - but for the record - I informed the team of the bug with dead ends, it wasn’t functioning how it was intended to and as such I was putting the needs of the many infront of the few as if you end up down a never ending dead end it really sucks.

I stand by what I said that the guides are really cool and this example from @Shadowfeld is one of them. Love it - on the team here we all know this information exists about the Underspire and which paths to take to avoid dead ends where the bosses are etc etc. But knowing all the information you’ve worked out the only thing we ever discussed or considered changing was the bug to the dead ends - not the other things you worked out. I promise if anyone had considered more than that I woulda fought them :angry:

We’re honestly not out here trying to give you folks a hard time, we haven’t gone and re-arranged the entire map generation for the Underspire like some maniacal corporate figures with cats in our laps - although if you saw our meeting room layout you’d probably understand why we joke about getting Sirrian a cat just for our conference calls.


We have only fixed the bug so that if anyone finds themselves in a dead end they’re not spending thousands of Gems and a bunch of real money to try to find their way out of it. If we were really nefarious we would have left it in and taken their money :woman_shrugging: it would have meant we also wouldn’t have needed to spend the time or money fixing it.

For people who do work out how it’s coded so they can min-max it KUDOS seriously, you deserve the benefits that gives you. However, I don’t think the game should be so complicated that you need to reverse engineer the procedural generation rules to play it without spending all your premium currency and money - and there’s definitely other areas of the game that could use some improving on this front - no denying that cough World Events cough

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If there are other changes I will be just as surprised as you so god I hope not.

I was told the issue was as simple as that one liner I posted - dead ends would try to fill the map - they are now restricted to no longer than 6 tiles.

As always, we will be keeping an eye out for any issues once we have the whole playerbase’s eyeballs on it, thousands of heads are better than 1 or however that saying goes.

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Even knowing the rules I have gone further than 6 steps before by accident so that would have helped me as well.

We absolutely want all players to have success with underspire so that’s a good change for everyone.

Bad would be to toss out all rules so fight that fight for everyone, as you said. :muscle:

That is true.

The game should tell people the rules. They’re simple enough to be included as you can see from the very handy graphic that was posted.

It is fun to see how things work for some people, but I guess that most players would love simple guides to how things work that they don’t have to try and find elsewhere.

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Thanks. Hoping next update the dead ends will be less than 6. Going down multiple 6 room dead ends still sucks.

6?! Lol. Last week I had a dead end with more than 20. Spent extra gems just to reach boss 3 within 1 turn later on the other end of the map.

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Is it possible to explain exactly that to everyone involved in any upcoming final decisions that involve the implementation of the “RNG”-factor? While one-sided often described as… “fun”, for the majority of players it just isn’t, never was, never will be.

Players love fixed rulesets which are helpful and guiding, but sadly most of the time aren’t provided as complete info with the game itself and need to be discovered by the players instead over time. To know exactly how much is needed to play to achieve the individual goal is awesome, because players need a form of planning for themselves, not everybody has the time to play the game daily for multiple hours.

An example but nothing to do with Underspire: Most players would agree that it is perceived as “not fair” if someone semi-active “lucks out” after a handful of matches to get a horde mimic while others, actively playing explore daily don’t get it since its release. If that example was inappropriate it can be used with anything else regarding Underspire, I’ve seen surreal maps of users (not only with endless corridors) while others seemingly by design were “more lucky” in finding the correct paths very direct and quickly without any “obstacles” and therefore had way less investment neeeded and way less time (wasted) playing.

conclusion:
-RNG = +player_happiness

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The thing is, whilst the developers might make the claim that they are not trying to get people to empty their wallets, the business division are definitely trying to do that. I’ve seen too many games get ruined because corporate wants to squeeze dollars out of people, while the developers are just trying to make something fun to play.

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Props to you Kafka, I know a lot more people than just myself have appreciated your more frequent/detailed communication lately! I’m not one who believes you and/or IP2 are nefarious cat-petting overlords, but a lack of communication can certainly result in some poor or difficult decisions, especially when the community regularly points out issues which are not responded to for long periods of time.

I know every time you post someone will be upset, but increased communication is good for both the community and the quality of the game. Thanks so much for dedicating a little more of your time to us crazy forum-dwellers! :blush:

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Appears to still be an issue.

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If the patch went through after the weekly rollover, it’s likely that this week’s mazes had already been generated. Might still be fixed for next week.

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Am I the only one that has had the worst map this week ever in Underspire? Is it a coincidence that it’s the same week the devs “fixed” something in Underspire?

I have the best map so far.

I guess it’s coincidence.

Some of my alliance mates complained as well while others are doing as before (or better, like me).