Will guild wars rules change?

Should I expect changes in the rules of the Guild War? We have been playing against dead guilds for a year now. Each time we gain 1,500,000 points, but we are only promoted by 8-10 brackets and we again play against the dead guilds. Interest in the game is declining. Events after potions are no longer of interest. Only the Guild War remains. But with the existing rules, we are simply not allowed to play with live guilds. We are forced to deal with those who, just as we tried, but could not and left the game.
Therefore, I have a question for the developers - will there be changes in the rules of the Guild War, so that dead guilds can not participate in it?
We want the Guild War to be interesting for all guilds, and not just for the upper brackets. You do not want this?

1 Like

They can’t be 100% dead. Time and again the devs have asserted that someone within a guild has to register the guild for GW manually. Guilds are not automatically registered. So the trick is getting “dead” guilds to stop registering if they aren’t going to play at all. But my guess is since it’s the only way to acquire the GW troops and there are a few other minor rewards they get at the end of GW week regardless how they place, that’s why they continue to register but then not play.

4 Likes

Wasn’t it that manual registration was scrapped and replaced with automatic because people kept complaining - our guild forgot to register, we can’t participate, help, help, help…?

I don’t recall that. I know the register button still comes up for us and tells us we’re now registered when we use it. I suppose it’s possible they changed it but never tiok the button out. Though why would they advertise in events right before GW week to make sure you register?

On xbox, in the September GW, we fought ‘active’ guilds of 3, 2, 1 and 1 on the last 4 days of our stay in Bracket 47. Recruiters were sent to try and tell them the benefits of joining the Horde, but some players are intent on staying in dead guilds.

This wars had us fight a few better opponenents in B39. At least we’ll continue to jump as long as we win. Finishing 2nd and only advancing 1 bracket would damage morale.

My advice is stay positive, and try to maximize points. Margin of victory and percentage of points within the total bracket leads to greater jumps. I’ve seen some jump from 47 to 30 to 14. (Not us tho)

Good luck all

1 Like

The Devs stated again last night on the Q&A stream that guilds must hit the register button to participate in GW.

3 Likes

I think the 10th place guild in each bracket should drop at the same rates as the winners climb.

I never got the whole “you have to register to participate” thing as being a filter for dead guilds.

The only reliable way you can get guild wars troops is through guild wars participation, even if you are far far in the lower brackets. Theres no reason not to register. This doesn’t filer any level of non-participation, just however many guilds aren’t engaged enough to have even one of the people have high enough rank to do so “click here for free rewards”. Just mail these rewards to everyone and require some kind of baseline qualification for “competition”, so that only guilds that actually show some level of participation might “compete”.

Although even that it isn’t very interesting when several brackets above and below you give the same rewards and your rank means nothing within the bracket does nothing, and daily wins only dispense a meager amount of seals that are only really significant if you already “finished” your seals for the week. Even as high as in brackets 11, everything within five brackets above and dozens below feels like pretty much the same in terms of overall rewards.

They could just leave it as is a make it a bracket 1 race and let everybody else ignore it, though, I don’t really need this game mode to be “for me”.

3 Likes

I still want to get an answer to my question from the developers.
In the last war, we were in 140 brackets. Scored 1506 516 points. And we were raised by 7 brackets. Only 7 brackets. This war will again be against garbage guilds. These people do not play. They are registered in the war for the sake of rewards. Why should we play against them? We want to play against active guilds. @Saltypatra
And I repeat my question. Will the rules for registering guilds in the war be changed so that guilds that do not play in it cannot register or play in the bottom brackets?
@Kafka in the spring, you told me that it’s quite active to play and the guild will quickly rise in the ranking of GW. It turned out to be a lie. Answer my question about the selection rules, please. This is a very important issue for us.

1 Like

It’s always been true in GoW that it’s easier to join an existing guild at the top than spend the months it takes to climb the ladder. I think the “well MY friend made it to the NBA” story used to be some guild that got to the top brackets in like 6 months. That was when GW was every week. Now it’s once a month. So estimate about 24 months of effort tops, but take maybe 6 months off that because “well now sometimes if you get lucky you’ll move like 2-4 brackets instead of 1.”

The point is the harder it is for your guild to progress, the more likely your guild members will give up and go join the guilds at the top. There’s a constant attrition of players leaking out, and they gotta get replaced. If players thought it was easy to make their own guild and unseat the kings, there’d be chaos at the top every GW as frustrated upstarts formed their own guilds, climbed the ladder, and occasionally unseated the kings. Instead, it’s much more challenging and interesting that the same 30 or so guilds always face the same other 30 or so guilds every week. The least possible healthy thing for competition is a situation where a very skilled newcomer can threaten an older player.

2 Likes

@Slypenslyde That is, you specifically made it so that the guilds that are in the upper brackets receive the players from the guilds in the lower brackets? That is, changes to the registration rules are not planned. So? Did I understand correctly?

Please do not misinterpret my words as those of a dev. I’m a player who has been here for 2 years. The devs’ official position, when they make it, is generally not a belief that these are major or addressable issues. There is and has been a rumored GW overhaul for years but there is no indication when.

The complaints you are making have been made even longer than I have been here. It’s kind of tough to design a bracket system that doesn’t go wonky, but this one’s really good at keeping people at the top while making it harder to get there. Things like the “27-member scoring” are a good example of the complexity.

For top guilds, it’s a boon, because churn among people at that level is huge due to ragequits and other oddities. It’s not uncommon for those guilds to lose 3-5 members per week. So dropping those results means they have a more consistent competitive experience… within their bracket.

It also means the guilds you are facing that do muster 25+ members will have a higher overall score compared to yours, which means it’s harder for you to climb multiple brackets. Oops.

The “best” solutions I have in mind are very convoluted and they make an assertion I don’t think most of the game makes: that the top guilds should be afraid of talented new guilds. The game doesn’t agree with this with any large margin so I don’t think any changes that support it will be made. I’d love to see a system that actually ranks guilds: everybody starts at 0, everybody is scored, and every week the winners are ranked based on what they did this week, not what they’ve done over the past 5 years. Then it’d mean a heck of a lot more to stay in the top 10, and holding #1 for any kind of streak would be a lot more amazing. But then a lot of people would get their ego bruised when a clan made out of former members pushes them out of the prize tier they “deserve”. (Speaking of: the prize tiers would have to change dramatically in this structure.)

Waiting for a response from the developers. @Kafka @Saltypatra
It depends on him what we will do next.
Or play, or perhaps disband.

I gotta point out that getting to top implies time, work and patience.

There is no game ever made or not made where you can get to top of anything signifiant straight away (or fast, or easily).

Not even irl competitions/sports do allow you to speed to top spots without all sort of hassles as leagues, promotions/demotions, qualifiers etc etc etc.

Think about this comparation: a newly founded football team needs averagely 4 years to get in the top national league and win it (assuming an European-style league system).

Even if that newly founded team would be composed of 11 clones of David Beckham and Pele, it would still need the same 4 years (4 seasons) to reach the top league as a team made of local drunken talents that can’t make the difference between a mango, a football and an opponents head🤷

1 Like

I am not writing about going up in the first brackets. I am writing about going up to where active guilds play with active. We have been playing against garbage guilds for a year now. I am not opposed to playing in 140 brackets or 350. But only against active playing guilds. Do you understand?
Yes, in football you can climb to first places for four seasons. But all four seasons will be held in a stubborn and interesting struggle. Now imagine that all four seasons the team will win with a score of 10: 0 every match. Will she have questions for such a selection?

Here is our past war. Do you think it was very interesting to play? And so they are all for this year.
Yes, we scored fewer points due to statues. But we did not meet resistance anywhere. Only once against one single guild. For the whole year.

2 Likes

football is really poor example. average career of professional football player lasts slightly less than 20 years. what Is average playtime of gems of war player? 2-3 years tops? sure, there are people who started at the beginning, but there are footballers that debuted for national team before they hit 18 and played till 40+ too.

every long term multiplayer game add catch up mechanics so new players can get to near-endgame state faster, so veterans would feel pressured, but will still be ahead due to knowledge, experience, and because last 5% is really hard to cover.

so far almost every update game had in past half a year made it so new players progress even slower, while long term players pull further and further away

1 Like

But that takes us to this question: what is endgame in GoW?

Is the top gw brackets THE endgame actually?

I would rather say that the recent updates (recent = 1 year) made the game more complex, but not neccesary harder. It’s a lot more to do, but particular objectives are still same easy/hard to achieve as 1 year ago.
A new player that joins a good guild now has exactly the same chances/bonuses to endgame as a new player half year ago, if not ever higher.

This has been our guild’s experience as well, and it’s incredibly frustrating.

3/4 weeks, we have the ability to put in effort and get rewards for doing so.

Every 4th week – and it’s not that we don’t like GW itself! – there is literally nothing we can do to improve our rewards in the (largely) foreseeable future (see next paragraph) beyond getting a bonus 50 Seals/day and a largely useless experience bonus.

We’ve been moving up the brackets for about 14 months now, and are yet to receive an increase in rewards. In perhaps another 2 iterations we’ll receive our first (our first!) increase (from 3 to 6 troops, 10 to 25 Gems) – but for now, we still get 3 measly copies of the GW troop, 10(?) Gems, and bleh. It’s quite frankly unacceptable, ridiculous and disgusting – and realistically, if this does ever get addressed, I’d like Gem and Troop compensation to match the new expected time for improved rewards. I placed a lower-level alt in an open-invite Guild that was much higher up in Brackets (~40), but much less active, and received better rewards for months without even really trying. Very un-Australian (read: unfair).

We don’t even get the chance to test out defences or acclimatise to tougher guilds – I was Paragon last war and I had somewhere between 0 and 2 (can’t remember exactly, but I do have the screenshots) people attack me the whole week.

:nauseated_face::rage:

I’m also scared I’ll lose my good players to the established guilds whenever the topic comes up in guild chat. It’s demotivating for everyone.


Comparing scores from setting defences/participation

Something that I think hasn’t been taken into account by the Devs when comparing the scores of guilds in higher and lower brackets (at least when responding here on the forums) is points earned from setting unique defences.

There are 360,000 points available to every Guild that are 100% unaffected by the strength of your competition, and solely by your own Guild’s participation (and understanding of the rules…).

There are still quite a few Guilds in the top 50 Brackets, as evidenced by the data on Taransworld, that score under this margin, and I think that is also quite unacceptable and ridiculous.

3 Likes

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

3 Likes

Uhhh on the spectrum of bad analogies this breaks the needle. As far as I know nothing in the NBA, MLB, or NFL rules states that a team is excluded from their championships due to age. The Olympics have age requirements but only require the athlete be non-professional (except, apparently, for baseball and a few other sports) and endorsed by their country. “Wow that was a record-setting performance but unfortunately it’s Michael Phelps’ first Olympics so he’s disqualified from winning a medal.” Sure. Similarly, most e-sports only ask that entrants provide their entry fee as far as I can tell.

For a lot of sports and games, it might take years to gain the talent to compete, but everyone is able to reach whatever constitutes “the top” in their tournaments. Sure, it takes playing a full regulation season in MLB to make it to the World Series, but last year’s winners have no advantage other than “They are obviously a good team.” Sometimes we have situations like Magic Pro Tour, where attaining certain levels guarantees invites to important tournaments, but if a prodigal newbie shows up they bump another champion out of the seat and it can happen in one year.

I don’t contest there are no sports that have a longer period because you’ve provided an example. But you asserted “there is no game ever made or not made” and there are actually a lot of games where in the unlikely event of a ridiculously talented new challenger the entire power structure will topple. What you mean is, "In most games, it takes not just skill but a remarkable amount of experience to reach the top so it is not often dominated by a newcomer. But, again, many Olympic Athletes are competing in their very first event and come home with golds.

Another fair point: how long does it take to get to the top of the Raid Boss leaderboard?

What you mean is what UKResistance said:

Screw you. Got mine. This situation benefits me so I’m going to make up some things and tell you to stop complaining because of those made up things.