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Rope Dart + Reflect = Lethal Damage

While I agree that this could be a good mechanic to counter the armor-stripping weapons + Megavore, I don’t like this because this is not what I expected. I just lost my hero in the middle of a GW battle because this is not an obvious consequence.
I would like this either changed, or properly documented.

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Every time there’s a loud, “You just want the weapon to be nerfed because you want the game to be too easy!” argument, there’s 10 people using the weapon on offense who don’t want the weapon to be nerfed because it’s a brainless win. (Nothing wrong with brainless wins, I prefer them. But if one weapon is among the top tiers for every event, it’s probably a little too powerful.)

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*raises hand* Guilty as charged, your honor.

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Same, really. I like brainless match 3s. GoW’s whole economy is built around “win as fast as you can” and Rope Dart’s good at that. I question if one team should be good at every event, but I’m sure as heck using it as long as it works.

I know. But it’s still a bit funny to watch the forum in general, when complains arise about both X and X’s perfect counter…

For the record, didn’t used rope dart for a long time, except sometimes on yellow day in gvg. Mountain crusher, life and death, and skeleton key are my nobrainers in events…

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Why isn’t that a valid counterplay? It allows players to use actual strategy against a third trait that is stupid and randomly awards wins for no strategy. To counter reflect, players will actually need to strategize and build a dispel option into their instakill teams. These are good things.

(If the devs want to be the most fair, they can offer refunds for all the troops/hero classes that rely on instakill/strip armor. )

I’m not necessarily saying reflect the way it currently does is a great design decision - it might make delving too hard, for example (especially against the upcoming Hall of Mirrors faction). But I would like to see how things play out a bit before calling for an immediate nerf, because reflect does provide a counter for weapons/mechanics that are significant pain points in pvp (and maybe GW too?).

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Just thought I’d note that this has been added to the ‘Known Issues’ list.

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Similar thing occurred before reflect barrier was introduced anyway. I was using Archer class and opposition had War in first slot. Archer class has a chance to instantly kill opponent troop with skull damage, and War troop has reflect percentage of skull damage. Even though my hero troop had 100 plus life and armor, as soon as I hit War troop with skulls and Archer class instant kill triggered my hero automatically died because it essentially reflected back a percentage of 1000 damage.

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As far as I know this is still happening, isn’t it? Wrath and Yao have infernal armor too, can be a pain…

A month and a half later: are there any updates on this? :pray:

A version of this just happened to me against Redhorn’s 25% Reflect trait in Primal Rift lvl 460: my Archer was OTK because my 3rd trait triggered… Both sides dead, one side left wondering how such a basic programming shortcoming made it to Release and has been allowed to stay in Release.

:sweat_smile::thinking::vulcan_salute:

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I think I can answer both of these questions.

There isn’t being anything done to the current game mechanics.

And they do not plan to change or rework how the Delves work. It was not mentioned anywhere.
If they do, it will probably take another year, but many people will give up until then.

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So this just happened again in 4.6 when my archer instakilled a troop with the 25% reflect trait (this time in a level 12 explore run, it would have been extra fun if I had lost the battle because of this programming shortcoming :blush:): so 48 days and one update later, we either don’t care or don’t know how to fix this?

Either way, it must not yet be “as soon as they can” :roll_eyes::thinking::sweat_smile::vulcan_salute:

Hey folks, just a reminder to please keep this on topic as it takes us a lot more time to weed out actual information about the bug report if you’re having discussions and going off on tangents in the bug report.

It’s important for any dev working on the issue to be able to look at player reports for more information if they need to without having to wade through a discussion.

It’s not that we don’t care it’s just that our schedule is blocked out months in advance and prioritised, so while we have bigger fixes and features in the works we may have time for smaller fixes around these tasks but maybe not something like this bug which requires us to re-evaluate how lethal damage works on the back end.

Things aren’t always as simple as they seem from in game when it comes to how it’s programmed in with all our other interactions and systems on the back end, especially given the game is 5 years old (which is why we have various wording and functionality differences between new and old troops which we are slowly bringing into line as part of a huge long term project in the background to all the other things you’re seeing being added/fixed in game).

Also, this interaction was tested and found to be working correctly prior to release.
I’m not personally sure what broke it, but when you put some hundred thousand + players onto a game something always breaks. #GameDevLife T__T

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I hope you have also considered that this is not broken, and should be left is. Armor-stripping is an extremely powerful spell effect, giving players a way to counter it would be a good thing.

The dev just acknowledged that it’s broken in the post above yours.

You mean the post I replied to?

(The original intent isn’t what matters; programming mistakes have led to gameplay improvements. What matters is what’s good for the game, and having a counter for one of the strongest tools in the game > any argument I can see against it.)

Put another way, if you have a choice between reflect being a meaningful status vs being an incidental effect like, say, bleed, why would you pick the latter?

As someone that codes, I have to disagree strongly. The original intent most definitely matters. Reflect was not created to deal lethal damage to armor stripping weapons. It is by definition a bug. According to the dev in this thread, it hasn’t been fixed “yet” because of technical reasons on the backend.

Also, Reflect states that it should reflect 50% of damage back to the damage dealer. Clearly, it should only deal that 50% of damage not automatic lethal damage because of the awkward way that armor stripping is coded in this game.

Hopefully, they will have this bug fixed by the next update.

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Wait, they still haven’t fixed that issue? :frowning:

I must say that I am disappointed by the lack of existing bugs that are not included in the Bug List.

On another note, I think that the bug with extra turns resurfaced again in this update.
I have used Apothecary and got a Cross-shape symbol conversion, but I was not awarded extra turns even though there were no freezing effects. It happened twice yesterday.

If it is not fixed before Mirror Hall faction is released… I may have found the perfect Rope Dart hard counter :hear_no_evil::see_no_evil::speak_no_evil:

Also lethal damage if got reflected kill the damage dealer, right?

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