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[Not a bug] Spells boosted by blessed allies do not benefit from caster

Platform, device version and operating system:
PC

Screenshot or image:



What you were expecting to happen, and what actually happened:
I expected that Vanya will do 48 + 16 = 64 damage to all enemies, but she only did 60

How often does this happen? When did it begin happening?
Always, probably it is this way since blessed was released

Steps to make it happen again
Use a troop whose spell is boosted by blessed allies, apply blessed on that troop, cast it’s spell, watch the effect is weaker.

Another effect resolution order bug. The blessed is removed when a troop casts a spell or does skull damage. When the spell is boosted by blessed effect the status effect is removed first then the boost calculation is done, which results in reduced effect.

Blessed goes away when you attack/cast.

3 things:

  1. tooltip is checking bonus before casting (and “on cast” mechanics activcation)
  2. damage is calculated after “on cast” mechanics are activated
  3. one of “on cast” effects is removing bless from unit casting

Not sure, if anything could be done with it. Same thing is with Voice of Orpheus damage (it’s mana is counted towards the bonus, but is removed from VoO before damage is counted and applied).
If anything, probably tooltips would need to have their code changed to ignore: mana/bless effects on the caster troop from being counted into tooltip…

Or the mechanism should be fixed, since this way these troops are even weaker.

3 Likes

A similar action order resolution bug present with “on attack” traits.
Webspiner always applies webbed before doing the damage so it does x3 damage all the time even against not webbed enemies.

Another interesting Rock Troll vs Silent Sentinel, rock troll stuns the enemy on skull dmg, silent sentinel silences the enemy when taking skull dmg, when this 2 meet the outcome is random. Sometimes rock troll gets silenced sometimes not.

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To be fixed soon™ as of 25/JUN/2020
:blush: :vulcan_salute:

2 Likes

Sure. Mechanism can be changed, but I highly doubt it will ever happen.

Is that so? That’s crazy, since it suggests race conditions might be affecting the outcome.

Edit: I just did some testing. I put Rock Troll and Silent Sentinel on my PVP defense team, and placed the other at the top of my attack team. In ten tries (5 with Troll on offense, 5 with Troll on defense), Silent Sentinel was stunned every single time when taking a skull hit. Rock Troll was never silenced. So my results do not match your claim—can you produce a video or a gif of Rock Troll being silenced when making a skull match against Silent Sentinel?

4 Likes

Out of curiosity, tested 10 times.
Sentinel stunned - 10/10
Troll silenced - 0/10

I don’t really care toying further at this particular moment, but I’m doubtful - believe when I see it, if you will.
Maybe you have a visual proof?

Edit. Hitting Blessed sentinel would not stun and would silrnce the troll, though.

4 Likes

Maybe it was fixed since then. It was a long time ago when I used Silent Sentinel the last time. I just remembered this anomaly.
The issue in the OP is still stands.

1 Like

No, it doesn’t. The issue you’ve posted about says they don’t benefit from caster. That’s not a bug. They lose Bless when they attack or Cast. What can be considered a bug is just visual, and many things suffer from it: Voice of Orpheus (it counts its own mana), Undine (if it’s submerged, it counts itself).

For you it is a visual bug, for me it is a real bug.
If it says the spell dmg is boosted by blessed troops and I have 4 blessed troops, I want to say a dmg which is base_dmg + 4 x boost_ratio.
Sorry you can’t understand a simple math.

It’s not a math problem… Blessed is a status effect, like Submerged, that is removed when you attack or cast. You are no longer Blessed or Submerged (or have mana in the case of Orpheus) when you cast, so it doesn’t count you. There are two solutions:

  1. Change how ‘boosted’ values show by knowing whether it should or shouldn’t include its own value (IE, subtract the mana from Orpheus in the calculation ahead of time)
  2. Change when Blessed/Submerged are removed to AFTER the cast, not before

Each one fixes a visual bug. In the first, the damage remains the same. In the second, the damage increases. So right away the second one will never happen, and in the first one, it would require a hefty amount of extra coding (every troop that has a boost would need to be checked to see if it needs to exclude a variable amount of damage from what it says is the boosted damage).

Yes and this is blatantly wrong in my opinion…

This isn’t a bug, this is how it’s supposed to work, and has been said as such by the developers.

Tbh, I thought it was actually the second that was more fundamental to various game interactions, messing with which would require a much larger amount of work than the first.

There’s a finite number of categories of spell that encounter this issue (boosted by allied Bless, allied Submerge, allied Mana…) so realistically I don’t think the tooltips would have to be done individually – I’m no GoW dev, though.

Fwiw, there is no game manual or tool-tip, whether in-game or in the Help Centre, that says certain positive status effects are removed after clicking ‘Cast’ but before the effects of any related Spell are calculated or take place. While VoO has been confirmed to be working as intended, I don’t blame Tibo for their interpretation of how the spell boost should work, and I don’t think their contention of this as a ‘real bug’ rather than a ‘visual’ one should be dismissed so contrarily without that context.

2 Likes

Probably the devs said this so they don’t have to fix it.

4 Likes

I imagine the following scenario.
myTroop.castSpell(enemyTroop){
myTroop.mana = 0
processStatusEffects()
dmg = calculateDmg()
enemyTroop.recieveSpellDmg(dmg)
.
.
.
}

In any other cases when you remove the positive status effects and deduct mana it won’t cause a problem. But for Vanya it does, as well as for VoO, and I assume the submerge boosted spells and weapons are also affected.

So it isn’t just a visual bug.

EDIT:
Boosted by submerged …
Weapon: Thingmabob
Troops: Kahrybdis, Mereshark, Mervorax, Nereida, Undine(can’t test this I don’t have him)

Edit2:
I tested it and all troops related to submerge are also affected.

It’s not math… it’s language. It doesn’t say troops, it says allies. For me… allies is a group that supports me, but not counting myself

If it allies the way you use the word, why the tool tips show the boost with including myself?
And here is this weapon for example:


Used the warden class, no other beasts in my team, and the dmg got the boost. it did 38 dmg. So apparently self counted as an ally.

1 Like