Naughty & Nice: Troop Balance

i love all the changes except for skeleton key… it’d make newer players harder to catch pets and do explores…

is it possible to have it nerfed to 7:3 or 5:2 ratio?

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Thank you for balance changes! :smiley:

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A huuuuuge one too…

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Thanks! That balance overhaul was badly needed.

I don’t really see why Bandit had to be nerfed, though. It’s not like it saw play for any other reason than Backup.

The SK nerf is pretty brutal, though. That’s going to hurt a lot of players. It might have been better to buff P&P instead.

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Why Skeleton Key??? Do you want players to buy the Shrines lol

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has anyone tried refunding a medaled bandit? I’d like to get a refund, but don’t want to lose the medal upgrade

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Firstly I thought - “Refund on Bandit! I can un-trait his detrimental 3rd trait!” :smiley:
1 minute later - “Oh no, it won’t work - I will start to waste my Daily Offer 2nd slot to permanent offers with traitstones to upgrade Bandit.” :neutral_face:

EDIT: Maybe it won’t work like that, see Mithran’s comment below. Will see in 1 day.

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Elite levels will remain.

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Buffs range from insignificant on rarely used troops to significant on rarely used troops. The few that might cross viability thresholds here are Venoxia (true damage spam), Carnex (might increase his generator viability, he was already a decent Impervious fairly low cost exploder, but initial boards really hurt him by having very few skulls even if you could get a quick start) and the extra gem to Elemaugrim/Ishtara, which is right at the point where the spell can be viable without boost ratio.

Its super confusing considering this was recently cloned and introduced with a bunch of clones all at 14 mana - cobaltine wand, arboreal crystal, fist of heaven, with many more likely coming even if they aren’t in spoilers right now, just following the pattern. Just those don’t create their own storms (at least not a rule, at least not yet), so maybe that was the reason behind the Jar nerf?

I really like the new 14 mana exploder + summon weapons as utility to be used on a varitety of situations and teams and had actually somewhat rekindled my interest in teambuilding recently. I hope hope this nerf doesn’t follow suit on them.

The skeleton key nerf suuucks. This was only done to slow down gold farming as far as I’m concerned. Has a negative impact on nearly every player while having a positive impact on very few. Yes, you can move to Plunder and Peril for damage in your gold setup, but it is mana blocked on any relevant team that has it and has no extra turn, both which impact the speed at which any of the best possible gold farming setups can actually farm gold.

Gobtruffle nerf meh. I kinda said this is where he should have been from the start. Will likely make him a bit harder to set up and when set up can still go the distance most of the time (judging from alts that have used it not traited, so it was always limited to spawning less gems than the traited one will now after it procs a couple times), but it will almost for sure make Amanithrax pure faction more difficult.

Life and Death nerf meh. Maybe people will stop complaining about it? Affects one of my bounty teams, but it probably isn’t to the point where it is unusable which makes it a good nerf.

The Skeleton Key nerf alone (and the reason behind it) kinda drags down any benefit gained from a lot of the buffs (and some of the reasonable nerfs).

Is this a condition that can even generate offers? I’ve never seen one slot 2 across any of my accounts. Also Bandit is from Pridelands, and slot 2 offers are always kingdom specific based on an uncompleted task, so if this isn’t a currently incomplete kingdom task, it won’t generate offers for slot 2.

Also brb Elite Leveling and then untraiting Bandit. I guess Bandit got a ninja buff this patch.

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My comment was for end-game accounts, like mine, which doesn’t receive any kingdom helper offers in 2nd slot and because of that are able to receive in that slot most valuable offers (for end-game accounts) like Imperial Deeds and writs.
For players with the complete collection, the current task for Pridelands is “Unlock 3 Traits on 25 Pridelands troops 24/25.”. If I will refund Bandit, task progress will go to 23/25 and tomorrow I will receive kingdom helper offer with traitstones to trait Bandit.
I prefer to have a chance to get Imperial Deeds and writs.

I want understand who decide for the nerf. I want understand how much experience have in this game. I appreciate the mythics buff. But i dont understand why they didnt touch the doom’s book, the only weapon really broken at the moment. I can understand you arent interested to fix the war in high bracket. But you break the new player’s leg: life & death and YOE can be obtaine without diamond cost and are really good for new player, sleleton key you can take easy playing thief class. Gobtruffle is a really good troop because you can take easy from the delve chest. I dont understand who is happy for this patch. You did nothing for high bracket war and you break the new’s player leg.

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a lot of people complained about life & death and gobtruffle. these 2 changes shouldn’t really surprise anyone.

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Untrue… thing is, before you unlock Zaejin to even have a chance to Unlock Thief and get his weapon… You will already have plaguelord lvl 40+ with EoE on board… You will also have a clockwork sphinx/rowanne team pretty early… (as soon as you finish quest line in Forest of Thorns)

Unless, it’s Zaejin week, and you use class event to get SK with Gems.

Might depend what you define as “new player”… but honestly, in early game EoE (with 0 upgrades on it), is much stronger weapon than SK (ability to entangle 1slot enemy, web/silence strongest caster/most dangerous caster… is WAY more stronger than dealing some gold buffed damage…)

Again, strong disagree… SK is not needed for pet events or explores, can easily be replaced by EoE
Plus, as people mentioned → you can use Corsair weapon instead… (random targeting and no extra turn, but similiar killing speed)

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What I’m saying is that I have multiple kingdoms across several accounts that are blocked by progress that includes “Unlock x traits on y troops”. Ie.,

But I’ve never seen a slot 2 offer for traitstones. Ever. Only a slot 1 one on a baby account (and thus likely one of those “account level” offers that I’ve never seen on level 1000+ accounts). And I can’t find any on this list either, except the aforementioned (element) combos/trove in the latter post:

Unless you mean the “kingdom helper” offer of 1 event key and gold for 25 gems is the offer that generates from not having a traistone milestone complete? In which case bleh, and also another example of hilarious misstep of the offers system because the items offered have nothing to do with what is needed to complete the task.

If not, it might be worth trying for one day to see what happens. You can trait it at any time after all, but this is your one opportunity to have it not traited, at least until the next kingdom milestone is completable and you want to stay at the top again.

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Thanks, I now see your point. I will definitely try to un-trait Bandit and will see what happens tomorrow.

I like the balance changes.

Personal thoughs on buffs:
Those with reduced mana cost, might find more use.
Might make Venoxia usable for anything.

Extra notes:
Might make delving harder when you encounter room with Venoxia.

As for nerfs:
Gobtruffle → yeep, it might make goblin team less loopy, on the other hand, doing Amanithrax pure faction just become harder (but people WILL find ways).
Bandit → dont see a reason for it, but whatever
Life and Death → will slow down LD casts, which is a good thing when fighting vs LD teams
SK → higher cost + lower damage. ok, will see if weapon is still usefull in this shape, if not will probably replace it with other stuff
Jar of Eyes → good small nerf, might prevent it from looping

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(Not mine) but another guild that does a shit load of LT seems to have every member just run nothing but Cedric teams. I imagine them doing over a 1k LT monthly apparently is what forced the devs hands here. In my opinion.

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I miss some troops to get nerfed and luckily they left some weapons be untouched

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@Saltypatra first of all, thank you for convincing the devs to do this balance update!

My few thoughts about the balance changes:

Urskula
She is clearly the far worst troop with trait: 50% mana start for X type of units. And buff included in this update won’t change this at all. She is dealing very low amount of scatter damage. She should get at least magic x2 buff to her scatter damage, and even then she would be pretty weak still. Queen Beetrix not only deals magic x2, but also true scatter damage, so it’s four times more effective! Same time, Queen Beetrix costs less mana, has chance to get extra turn and spawn gems, so setting nice board and another chance for extra turn. Such low damage on Urskaya with no board control or extra turn chance is just useless.

King Gobtruffle
Yes, Gobtruffle was way too good, so this nerf is justified for sure. My question is, why Beetrix was untouched in this update? Beetrix is very similar unit to Gobtruffle, and now Beetrix costs 14 mana, while Gobtruffle 18 mana. Beetrix spawn 18 gems (always - without any additional conditions!), Gobtruffle 14 gems (which can be boosted). Beetrix can gain half mana back when casting, Gobtruffle can’t. And traits are much better on Beetrix. Touching Gobtruffle without touching Beetrix seems like very strange way of balancing things.

Bandit
Main problem of Bandit was his final trait, Stealthy. With this update and refund option, you allowed people to get rid of this “broken” trait and keep amazing unit forever. I feel sorry for everyone, who won’t be able to fully upgrade bandit, and then just remove his 3rd trait, as this will be impossible in the future!
The thing with Bandit is, it is mainly used in teams as random summon option, when your ally dies. If your hero has Stealthy trait and Bandit has not, you can’t target hero directly and therefore you can spawn a lot of bandits! If both hero and summoned Bandits have stealthy, people can kill hero directly and get rid of it’s summoning trait. So this update will put every single player, who don’t use Refund option right now in big disadvantage in the future. In current form, you can call this update biggest buff ever for Bandit, but only to players, who will use Refund option for limited time! In this situation, I think it would make more sense to just replace 3rd trait of Bandit with other trait, to make it fair for everyone.

Life and Death
Increasing mana cost from 15 to 18 is a good change for sure. But that’s not enough, L&D will still be too strong. And what about other “broken” weapons, like Rope Dart, which still has very low 14 mana cost?

Skeleton Key
Mana cost increase is fine, but why touching boost ratio on this weapon? Skeleton Key can feel overpowered to new players only. It is not used in big events or PVP, for older players, it is only gold farming option and nothing more. Skeleton Key before update wasn’t breaking any balance in the game. In fact, as new player I loved this weapon, it kept me playing some guild related events easier. This weapon was one of those things, which allowed me progress in reasonable pace as a new player. But when I experienced a bit, I stopped using it - there are better options basically everywhere (beside gold farming). After change, Skeleton Key won’t be useful even for gold farming (Plunder and Peril will replace it in this task). So changing boost ratio was like killing Skeleton Key completely from my perspective.

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It was already very luck based. Yes if you’re really lucky 5 rooms in a row, sure even low level players can loop infinitely. Not my experience sadly.
Having spent more than a dozen sigils, this is a double nerf that wasn’t needed, with no compensation for pure faction delves. It now creates only 14 gems which drops probablity of matches, by north of 10%. Even when there are matches, the mana gate is now 2 extra, which is significantly harder to reach, i.e 2 x 3-matches both mana surging with green+2 banner gives 16 mana, still short of full.

Very big dislike, personally, only due to pure faction.
In terms of communications, some sort of lead time like 7 days (21 attempts at delves) before these kick in would have been appreciated.

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