My thoughts on 2.1


#1

I know it’s only couple days since 2.1 arrived. I just want to post my thoughts out regarding 2.1.

I don’t see any point or benefit for being a hardcore player anymore since we can’t get more seals once it capped or donate more gold to guild. I’ve got 1500 seals and my guild has done all tasks 12/12 by Wednesday. At that point I don’t see the point to PvP-ing anymore. I have donated 2.7M this week and still got like 1.5M and I don’t know what to do with it. In a normal week, I usually donate around 1.5M. In a good week I double it. I could race to top 10 again if I wanted to but I’m kinda lost my energy when I found out that I can’t donate more gold or earn more seals. The reason I’ve been PvPing a lot because I can donate more gold to guild. Ranked was just a bonus pride for me. “But there are personal ranked PvP and guild rank?” Hell with that. PvP ranked rewards are not worth the effort to get them. And trophies are lame, for now. (idk if they will make trophies more worth to get in the future). People will always claim their guild is the best no matter what. So I don’t care too much about it. Devs want more money? It’s okay I get it. But don’t limit people who spend more time than money in this game too. Believe me I would buy / donate my money if I could. But again I see no reason in game to be hardcore.

And casual players are punished for not putting in the hard time to earn 500k+ a week. It’s about the reward for effort that is the problem. You pay far more and are rewarded with less for tasks. There is no incentive to put in the work casual players are not able to put in the effort required for any of the good rewards. And once capped hardcore players see no reason to play for the rest of the week.

For example the souls cost progression on purple statue is 50 gold escalating to 750 gold each. Lets forget that souls was one of the 2 tasks that were declared a waste of gold in the old system. Now it is even worse as you cant level up purple mastery without buying them. 750k for 1000 souls.

The gold keys are just as bad and the glory keys are terrible too. The more you pay the less you get. On yellow tasks 236 glory keys = 2.6 mil. The same funds before would have paid 866 glory keys and 216 blue tokens. It’s like, as a friend said, you want 1 pepperoni pizza $10, you want 2 $25, you want 4 $80.
Most businesses reduce the cost with bulk purchases.

Using the soul example again I believe it would be better if they set a base value for the souls. Say 250 each and adjust the task fee and reward to be relevant. So at 750k gold you should get 3k souls as an example, but at 2500 gold first task you get 10 souls. This could also apply to keys gems and everything else. A set value each not an escalating price the more tasks you fill.

That’s it I guess. Pardon my English. XD


#2

In general I get your point, like you said - close to no incentive except for personal e-peen to pvp for top ranks. And I agree with what you said about the cost for resources (esp glory keys and souls). I would however say that, if more “stable ratio” should be introduced - it should start around 7th or 8th task upwards. Those first few were made with super-ROI (return on investment) on purpose, so that the people who play solo or are in small 2-5 ppl guilds of friends can enjoy the game (without really being a threat to the top people “because they get more for less”), so those I’d leave be :wink:


#3

Also remember that the skill bonuses are factored in to the gold cost to max out a task. So on the surface it looks like you’re paying a crap load of gold on very little rewards, but you gotta factor dem skills in.


#4

The patch has changed my guild for the better.

In a normal week, we would get under 500k donated easy. Alot less usually, maybe ~300k.

This week, in 2 days, we have all tasks at 6 with only 2 there and the rest at 7. We have almost hit 10k seals, despite a few of us hitting rank 1 before patch came out and got none from that.

It has seen them flooded with resources that normally they wouldnt get, and as such makes them want to donate more to get more rewards to get better faster.

Id say we are a mid tier guild, and so far its all been positives. The patch was aimed for people around that tier, not for high end people.

I get you are frustrated and get bored/worn out cause nothing left for you to do. Now you know how alot of the mid tier people felt getting no where unless putting in insane amounts of time that alot just cant commit to for a game.


#5

I kind agree…it really has motivated our guild - but I wonder how long that will last.

I right now am torn about about the keys. Part of me still has a crapload of ascending that needs to be done. Heck finally got my 2nd Gorgon tonight after playing him for over 3 months…

I get more Mad Prophets and priestess than any other card - kinda makes me wonder if there should be a DUNE deck (let’s see if anyone gets the reference there)

But I still think it is too early to tell about the over all effect this will have Guilds and Guild playing.


#6

My friend is in a casual guild and he was happy to get tier 1 PvP and then just chat or explore for resources, and pvp got the gold to make a nice casual donation to guild and felt good for the resources that gained. Then the little extra from explore etc was about half as much on average but again helped the guild and the lower level players in guild. Now that feeling is just not there. For him 400k was average casual play donations. Now there are tasks take all of that and more. It’s not fun anymore, it’s hard work.

You said the patch was aimed for mid tier guild? Then what’s this patch has brought for top tier or lower tier guild/player as I stated on my post?


#7

And sirrian has said things will be tweaked and they are looking into other options for gold as well, but wanna see how it goes 1st.

It depends on the guild i guess. I run mine, and have 0 problem if people only donate small amounts, aslong as they donate something now rather than leach.

If in a 30 player guild everyone donates 262k each, all tasks will reach level 10. If you dont push for level 12 and just go for the rewards thats plenty to donate imo


#8

The diminishing returns is there so that lower levels and more casual guilds get a higher return on investment for their time than the higher guilds, as a means to even out the distribution graph into a more gentle curve rather than the massive cliff it was before. Having an increasing reward metric rather than diminishing returns would have completely defeated the purpose.

Instead of thinking it as “1 pepperoni pizza $10, you want 2 $25, you want 4 $80”, it is closer to “3 pepperoni pizza $5, afterwards you can get 4 for $10, and after you have bought that you can get 5 for $20, then 6 for $40, etc” You are getting a great deal at first, then less of a deal, then full price, then overpaying. Also, said pizzas could be redeemed at any time and the deals reset ever week. Also, this is the only pizza place in existence, and they stop selling them to you after you have bought so many per week, and pizza is the only edible item in existence. Or maybe the pizza analogy just doesn’t work.

I’ll agree on two points - the return on investment for purple and yellow tasks is horrendous. Purple is lower return on investment of souls per gold than pre 2.1 souls tasks which was already universally considered a waste of gold by just after the halfway point, and over the entire task line, cost around 200% as much overall. Yellow Glory Key tasks are worse return on investment than prepatch by level 4 of the task (level 3 considering just the individual tasks) and over their entire line cost 367% as much, and the last 5 levels of brown, being copies of yellow only available after the RoI drops off, are even worse. In addition, far too few glory keys are given per week in this new system, period, to ascend or even build a collection above rare at a reasonable pace. Gem tasks (gem keys, event keys, gems), on the other hand start off much stronger and hold their RoI compared to the previous version for much longer - up to level 8 or 9, and the total cost per gem over the entire task is only about 116%. All relative returns should be about where the gem numbers are now, with souls possibly being even higher because they were already considered bad previously.

Gold Keys are not bad, though, especially for their cost. They are almost free in a 30 person guild. Enjoy them, and the removal of the “common” bottleneck after a bit of time. Although getting higher rarties to mythics is going to take a lot more doing going forward, especially after you have burned through your backlog of resources collected from the old economy.


#9

i am in a casual guild i’m not sure what to think about it xD i dont like the loading time when i press the guild =P
but ppl are still leveling their kingdoms in my guild and have less then 500k gold each week(whole guild)

To be honest i like the other resources but my problem with it is that not all my guildies are speaking english or not checking the guild chat.
So i cant get a hold of what they do with the tasks and there is nothing i can do about it,…
i can kick them but i dont want to becuase everyone deserve a chance ^^

And i think it is buffed for the high tier guild altough if you cant donate all your gold,… thats just useless xD
but next week high tier guilds will be getting more and more stats so fighting them in pvp will be truly a nightmare.
The pvp matching system is bad(with the new guild update) for the new ones sometimes the weakest is still stronger then i am and thats without the guild buffs and even if we wanted we cant even finish 1 task to full
(i though my guild was a mid tier rank but,…i think it got lower =P)

i truly truly understand the way you think about it, why dont they just give some kind of extra tasks after those 12 its weird that you cant donate more then the tasks let you.

well thats what i think xD
my conclusion is that i kinda like it but it needs to be chanced ^^


#10

I kinda like the idea. I heard something about mythic task?


#11

I kinda feel the same about it. The limit at seals is deeply annoying. It feels like I’m not being paid for my overtime. Thats a robbery. Make it to count for guild till 1500 and the rest, whats done above that number, leave for me to use as I gained it playing more, if you have the need to limit anything.
And I feel exactly the same about gold and PVP. All these limits kinda killed my warrior’s spirit :grin:
In the next weeks I’ll prolly have to race at Monday to contribute anything to guild before every task will be done already. Thats madness.
So far, the one and clearly good thing is that I get a cool gift for every lvl :smiley:


#12

Maybe they should allow players to get seals even after they reach 1500 seals that are also factored towards guild total seals. But after 1500 seals only the player would get seals, and guild total seals wouldn’t keep increasing.
As for the tasks, I agree there should be some extra tasks after all 6 groups are completed. No reason to restrict a player from buying stuff.

It a very bad strategy to not push for level 12 at least for +2 magic (but +3 attack is also a lot). I know everyone has their own tactics but reaching level 10 and not going further is just bad.


#13

I’m in a 4 man guild together with my parents and a friend of mine. We’ve donated 400k Gold already and we still have lots of things to do.

I usually focus on leveling my troops to their current max (I’ve discovered that doing so makes them appear randomly in Explore so that’s a plus). And we’re convinced that we get more than before 2.1.

I don’t think that those numbers will stay forever. Maybe 2-3 weeks until the devs have collected enough data to tweak a few numbers here and there.

I can’t really discuss much in that topic, because I have a lack of interest in other guilds affairs and didn’t really mind guild payouts until now.

That’s a wonderful idea. :slight_smile: I’m only playing 2-3 hours a day and I’ve already collected around 700 Seals in two days. If a casual player like me can hit the cap inside a week, then everyone can.


#14

Yes. Maybe after a player capped at 1500 seals, they still can get seals but lower. Like 1 seal per PvP ranked win or any win, something like that?

Exactly. Now imagine what a more active player could do. There’s nothing they can do in term of helping guild through gold donation or seals once they capped both.


#15

2-3 hours a day isnt casual!


#16

When I say 2-3 hours, then I mean the time I hang around in GoW. I like to hang around in chat a lot or just voice-chatting with friends while I’m at it. I don’t play that much matches to be honest (20-25 yesterday).


#17

Yep if anything I kind of enjoy having a Guild Task and Seal cap, after I hit those it’s totally up to me if I want to continue to grind trophies for prestige, hit explore to gather trait stones or you know, go out and do something else for a change! :wink:


#18

Id say I am just as inefficent!


#19

In inefficience lies the fun hidden :wink:


#20

I think 2.1 is a first step for the Guild Wars, so i would hold my horses for a while because we don’t know exactly what is “being cooked on the kitchen”.
After we reach the seal’s cap i think it’s a weird feeling that we miss something that didn’t existed before… Just saying because i share the sentiment, but i shake it off and go around playing for fun or farming missing Arcanes.