Devs, Devs, Devs 🤦

Haha this is the best description of GW I’ve seen in ages.

I don’t know what you’re going on about DE though. If that still means “Dragon’s Eye” I feel like a strong fart’s been a fairly effective counter since the nerf, so as long as you have a troop with more power than that you’re good. :man_shrugging:

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I think s/he meant “had” but mistyped “has”

Old DE had very few counters, if any

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I was referencing pre-nerfed dragons eye of course. Not the current dragons eye. It was brought up as a comparison early in the thread and I thought it was ridiculous to bring up a weapon that actually had reason to be nerfed vs. this troop. Haha and I’m a he as well. Pronoun wars>Guild Wars

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Yep… I’m 100% wrong.
Any troop that can loop to affinity is definitely not OP.
I see the light now. Thanks ladies and gents.

Please tell me when you think you’ll have to face 4 empowered King Gobtruffles? Never is the answer. And in GW you’ll only face 1.

Unless you’re saying it’s too strong as an attack troop now? I don’t recall anyone ever asking for a nerf on these forums because a troop is too good in attack. Only when it’s a grief in defense have I ever seen “please nerf” threads.

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I’m not saying anything. Just posted the video for folks to decide their own opinions for themselves.

I’ll take that as a yes. In which case I would say why on earth would you want a great attack troop nerfed? Aren’t you the one I’ve seen many times commenting on how lackluster a new troop is? We finally get a good one and you want it nerfed. :man_shrugging:

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Well it wasn’t a yes. So I guess your questions were predetermined regardless of my response.
I’ve made my thoughts on the troop quite clear already. No need to rehash it.

Surely a non-misleading video would include zero potions? :thinking::sweat_smile::stuck_out_tongue::vulcan_salute:

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Yeah, that video clearly does nothing in terms of proving anything other than that troop is great with potions. We already have a lot of self looping troops that are far more powerful and without potions I may add. You’re so far off the mark on this one you. I did mang with 3 ysabelle in delves this week and it was just as OP and fast. Gonna nerf Ysabelle now? No, because nerfing a troop or team that’s almost solely OP because of potions is ridiculous.

The troop is good and in fact I’ll give you great in terms of looping. But to say it should be nerfed because of an event use in offense without any justification or proof its OP outside of it, is certainly mind boggling. With all the annoying pvp defenses, you’d think having a good offensive troop would be welcome.

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People aren’t questioning the worry, they are questioning the data.

Just like with old DE and so on, we have to consider how the weapon plays on offense vs. how it plays on defense, both in and out of scaling contexts. We tend to call for nerfs the strongest when a “defense with no scaling” context is powerful. In short:

  • We know that on offense, with potions and stat boosts, the troop is pretty darn strong. We win more matches when that’s true so we don’t care so much. It’s also notable that there are LOTS of things broken in this scenario.
  • We know that vs. a very scaled defense, this is an oppressive troop if your counters don’t get online fast enough. I think people feel “it’s as bad as any other goblin” in this scenario.
  • People who have tested with no potions/boosts don’t feel the troop is as powerful as other choices, and no contrary evidence exists.
  • People who have tested with no potions/boosts don’t feel the troop performs as expected on defense, and no contrary evidence exists.

Also:

  • A single video of its best luck isn’t a good data set. It takes a lot of matches. To some extent, more time has to pass to allow people to figure out how often its “good luck” happens. If you can set up the best offense vs. your best theoretical defense and demonstrate you lose 50% or more, the troop is scary broken. But if you’re winning at 75% or better, I think that is well within the error bars of “normal luck vs. Goblins”.

I don’t like Goblins period. I feel like “as bad as any other Goblin” is a good reason to not release a troop. But my opinion is harsher than everyone else’s.

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Agreed. While I sometimes encounter interesting (which can be good, bad, or anything) teams in GW and it is relatively low effort on account of not a lot of battles, it doesn’t stimulate me to create new teams and the rewards are a joke compared to both weekly and pretty much any other event.

I find the vast majority of nerfs that are called for are primarily over GW grief. Although I totally understand and dread seeing them in GW as well, I generally do not like nerfs except for obvious problems such as Fizzbang when she was initially released. I especially do not like the call for nerfs focused primarily one event type that occurs once every four weeks and has a limited reward scope for 99% of players. I understand that some of these troops and weapons can be a blight to face in regular PvP as well but you can always avoid them, even the seemingly ubiquitous ones if you like.
I have to wonder how prominent the calls would be to nerf these troops as well as weapons like Rope Dart if GW did not exist. I would prefer to see a developer work-around solution regarding GW instead so these troops and weapons can be enjoyed by players in the other facets of the game without being nerfed.

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As much as its fun to blame GW for everything, Rope Dart and Life and Death are getting blamed in the name of frequency in PvP.

Any call for a Yao Guai nerf can be blamed on GW, if that’s still a thing.

I don’t know - from my vantage point, I see a great deal more diversity in PvP now than ever before. There is no single meta team dominating the landscape as there was back in the Divine Protector or pre-nerf Kraken days.
Of course Rope Dart / Life and Death teams can be a complete pain to face. However, I simply avoid them in PvP if I don’t want the grief. The most vocal arguments I see are still rooted around GW.
That being said, I still firmly believe that the primary issue at the very foundation of all these “overpowered” troops and weapons is the plethora of empowered gem converters that keep being released.
It really does not matter if current grief troops or weapons are nerfed or not. There will always be others incoming that will synergize with one or more of the empowered gem converters.

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I agree with that 100%

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To me guild wars a while back was basically boring. I went 33 days without a loss and could brag to anyone that would listen but we were playing checkers. Now with all the hero classes and converters we are playing chess because now you have to use the thing between your ears to always look for a counter. Be lazy once and it could cost you a battle. The people that are good Guild War players complain mostly because of lack of time to look for counters most likely. The great guild war players complain about it too but still go mostly 5/0. The bad players probably don’t care because they were bad before so not much has changed on their end. I like it because I will take chess over checkers any day of the week and twice on Sunday. So bring on more converters and rough OP troops. It’s the same for everyone. Remember there is a counter to everything but you do have to look for it. Just my opinion.

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Pfft. Talk to me when you’ve been 330 days without a loss. I do it with 3 troops too, because I’m so bored.

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well I always thought I know how to sort it out but I cant I feel sorry…

17 months later, Gobtruffle is finally nerfed.

So about year and a half seems to be the delay effect between the designers seeing that they are wrong and doing something about it. Joy. :wink: