City of Thieves is literal proof y'all have no idea what you're doing

Play your game.

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Gem/Skull spawners dependent Faction when you’re still clearly using the “combo breaker” mechanic. Makes this game into a literal slot machine. Zero skill. Pure luck. Huge waste of time.

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I’m just going to sit back with popcorn while people line up to tell you “everything has a counter in GoW” and if you had a giant brain like them you’d have finished like them with their 100% win rate.

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Oh the horror. Troops from a faction are not OP.

Guarantee someone would complain if they’re so op you cant beat them easily when trying to do a lvl 500 delve…

gasp now who would do such a thing?

Please hire play-testers to play your game from the players point of view.
I remember the devs said something along the line of “We want delves to be a lengthy endeavor that keep player occupied for months”. Yet you designed Delves and Delves events so that the best time to “finish” it was right after it is introduced. Anytime later than that and the player is at a serious handicap.
I wonder how many of your play testers was able to finish “City of Thieves” full faction run or even come close to it without potions with a reasonable hoard level.
That was about this delve.
Now a quick question for both players and devs regarding the new Challenge
What is the incentive to play Challenge right now? The rewards is minuscule, the time needed is enormous, it is not needed for kingdom level anymore (is it?)

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While this is obviously a pretty bad case of it … what faction-vs-faction matchup has been fun so far? Any of them? No, I didn’t think so.

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I agree. Lets remove potions from delve events. They’re the reason events are no longer “Lengthy endeavor that keep players occupied for months”. After all, why spend months grinding, when you can buy Tier 7 50 times and complete it on the weekend? (slight exageration)

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This was the first all-faction delve that I had done, and the last. I was able to complete it after sheer luck with the following team:

  • King of Thieves
  • Tomb Robber
  • Tomb Robber
  • Street Thief

Luckily, due to the layout of this delve, I only had to win 3 battles. This came through rolling the dice to get good random skull placements that cascaded into a 4-match for my side, otherwise with skulls on the board I would be dead. Cat Burglar is a troop that is not worthwhile in this all-faction, as the damage does not scale to the levels needed to deal with level 250 enemies. I (and others) have found only King of Thieves could gain enough stats to survive some hits, as well as skull-bash and cast to kill enemies.

Although 4.5 claims that there is an “all faction solution” with Kingdom Level 14, I do not believe this will have any success whatsoever.

Let’s look at doing it “opening weekend” with potions and a level 100 hoard:

  • Gems are exploded in the beginning of battle, so you start off at a mana advantage
  • Everyone gets a barrier
  • Everyone starts with blessed
  • Everyone gets 25% skull reduction
  • Everyone starts with enchanted
  • +7*X to stats (in my case 112 which was 15 purchases: 3000 gems just on Tier 7)
  • +18 attack, +9 magic, +36 life, +36 armor

Let’s look at it doing a non-event delve, assuming level 14, and a level 100 hoard:

  • +27 attack, +13 magic, +54 life, +54 armor

Let’s look at it doing a non-event delve, assuming level 14, and a level 200 hoard:

  • +54 attack, +27 magic, +109 life, +108 armor

Let’s look at it doing a non-event delve, assuming level 14, and a level 500 hoard:

  • +136 attack, +67 magic, +273 life, +271 armor

You can see the huge disparity between an event and non-event delve. You can’t even come close to the magic bonuses at the highest possible hoard tier.

Something further needs to be done for the all-faction run. I don’t know what the actual solution is, but here’s a few areas to start:

  • Significantly dropping the gold costs needed to add a treasure to the hoard
  • Significantly increase the experience that a treasure provides to the hoard
  • Increase the level 12 and level 14 faction hoard stats bonus.
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I actually didn’t hate All Seeing Eye. Nail biting without actually biting nails, but kept me on my toes. Pre-potions.

Anything that requires potions is auto not fun though.

I guess I want to point to a few posts back and yeah there are two statements that don’t reconcile.

  • A dev says, “We want this to be a lengthy endeavor that takes months to complete.”
  • The game says, “During this 3-day or 1-day event, you can buy enough sigils to finish in one day and we’ll boost your stats if you try.”

One or the other.

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Hey, we appreciate the feedback but please remember we’re human too and don’t necessarily respond the best when being told we suck every time you want to post your opinion! You may want to change the title of your thread @awryan . We don’t need smoke blown up our ass but being insulted in your thread title doesn’t exactly help the discussion start off on a positive constructive footing.

I’ll pass your concerns onto the team :slight_smile:

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we were begging for a year for a solution to pure faction teams being awful experience to play or complete. we were promised during a q&a stream “you’ll be able to do something cool with your hero in pure faction” and instead we got +9 attack, +4 magic, and +18 life and armor in a few months when we collect enough deeds for 1 kingdom.
I don’t think that kind words made any progress thus far

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Yeah… Pretty sure I don’t do that. But also I didn’t say you sucked. Whoever is in charge of Delves has no idea how divided they are making their player base. If the goal is to burn out your customers… then that’s what’s being achieved as we speak.
I would love to know what the ideal hoard quality that is expected to clear each Faction with an all Faction team is. Or, how many tiers they expect you to buy to get a Faction to 2500 in a weekend. And if that’s not intended… Then what is actually being done to make it realistic to get a Faction to 2500 without wasting a ton of gold on one singular Faction.
In all seriousness…I hope the devs remember that we are human as well. And we play GoW for fun. Not to have it suck the souls out of completionists.

What will help then? Because what’s going on in the direction of Factions is polar opposite to actually making them easier.

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I quite enjoy the delves however once they get to around lvl 300 they are insane to beat without the right chars, the faction teams are great in 1st an last rooms but it’s usually the skills in the inbetweens that kill me, I invest a heap in each faction to get the hoard to 150+, some will prob say “just do 1st an last rooms” but this devalues the end chest lvl. Increasing the hoard past this requires an insane amount of gold with not much difference to player power lvl, the enemy lvls go from hard to omfg insanely fast. The delves should be challenging but a bit more player sided oomph would be good!

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What a truly awful pure faction delve. I’ve spent thousands of gems to try to beat this at 500 using the faction team, and it just isn’t happening.

I’ve spent over 1800 gems on Potions of Power to give my guys +63 to All Stats. My Treasure Horde Level is at 101 (+18 Atk, +9 Magic, +37 Life, +36 Armor), I’ve defeated it at 500 with no casualties using a non-faction team.

But stats can’t make up for terrible troops. There is no front line. Two troops: Tomb Robber and Street Thief, have 20% dodge chance. But even getting hit once at 500 will kill them. I’ve had the enemy team literally just make a normal match and whoops, skulls fall and match up and my front troop dies.

Meanwhile the only way to actually get gold is to make 4/5 gem matches, but you have no way of creating storms, no way of converting gems, you only have Street Thief which is useless in the Legendary Room because there is no gold to steal from the enemy.

Cat Burglar does no damage whatsoever. 100+ to two last targets. The enemies have nearly 400 Armor and Health. While I would have to hit them 8 times to kill them with Cat Burglar, they kill me in a couple of turns.

I’ve done Dark Pits, Stonesong Eyrie, Sunken Fleet, Amanithrax, and Sea of Sorrow all with faction teams. They’re all at 2500 renown.

I really saddens me that this comes out and I can’t complete it. Here’s my advice devs: actually play test something before you release it. Did someone actually beat it at level 500 using only City of Thieves troops? How many Potions of Power did they use? How many attempts before they won the RNG lottery?

I had 5000+ gems before this weekend. Now I have 2500 because of this event, and I only have 2000 Renown to show for it, because the faction team just, well, sucks. It’s just not good. The troops are probably really good in other situations, but they don’t scale AT ALL.

And those 2500 gems? A lot of those gems I bought in flash sales. That’s MY money I gave to you guys, and I didn’t get what I wanted out of it. So next sales I’m skipping. Seems fair enough, right? You want me to spend my money on your game – well, I will do that when I get what I want out of the game. You said you were making factions at 500 easier, but I don’t see proof of that. This one is by far the most difficult one yet.

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I would personally like to see this on the next dev stream. 1.5 hours aren’t needed just to preview the next Mythic. Take half an hour and struggle through play City of Thieves at level 500 with a faction only team. Feel free to give yourself a 300 Hoard.

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I came here looking to see if there was some way to beat this level 500 all faction delve. Glad to see I’m not the only one struggling.

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Salty tried level 100 stonesong with normal team and failed miserably

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I was able to beat 500 pure faction thanks to cedric room. 2x king, thief, robber. Keep boosting kings stats

One of the most frustrating parts is that you spend all these gems to get enough sigils to even finish the normal rewards and you get cool things like barrier and bless and explode and enchant… now if you don’t want me to get to 2500 with this, then explain how I’m supposed to do it without any of those benefits, without any potions of power. because even with deeds, the stat boosts from deeda will never be higher than potions of power can give, and if I can’t even do it with that and all the other status effects, I’m never going to be able to do it period.

try doing hall of guardian at even 2300 let alone 2500 with pure faction and no status effects or potions of power. it’s impossible. so I’m left with spending nearly 3000 gems to get enough potions of power that I just out stat the enemies. but even with that, city of thieves pure faction is horrendously unbalanced and impossible for most players. it is not balanced at all and I don’t think the devs actually tried it themselves.

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