there useful for upgrading kingdom weapons which are needed for upgrading star lvls so there still more useful than the treasure troops which drop like gangbusters from chaos portals
Piggybacking a bit on @The_Freak comment about this. I agree, it does not take 8 hours a day to play at a high level and contribute a lot. Iâve seen this claim from 8 hours to 20 hours a day while mostly exaggerations, are def not even close to reality for most players.
Using this as an argument to why this hurts the average gamer is completly false. Sure this hurts the average player who wants to stay average and get all rewards. But if you want the best rewards you can play more actively and get them. Itâs not the games fault players want to play casually and reap benefits other players play harder for.
I truly feel for the guilds who will now miss LTs, but itâs not impossible for players to jump into an active guild to get them still if they are willing to contribute. For an endgamer contributing 1-2 million gold a week is not impossibly hard.
I did some quick math and I think youâre right. But that my 8 hour estimate was wrong doesnât really change my gut feeling.
Iâll bet 2 hours of constant play/day is far outside the average GoW playerâs average. Sirrian quoted 26 matches as the average playerâs activity/day. Thatâs only about an hour if theyâre playing really slow, and more like 30 minutes if relatively fast. It represents 282k per week based on what I tend to get out of PvP rewards, less if they spend any of those matches on pet rescues, raids, etc. If theyâre optimally Explore farming I have it pegged at 1.7m but I highly doubt level 12 explores with a farming team are doable in 1m or less, I will defer to someone else because honestly I havenât tried it because it doesnât seem fun to me.
Itâs hard for me to build the case I want because thereâs not a published formula for how much gold a player might expect out of a mode. So Iâm just going to lean on that it sounds like 1-2 hours a day is still in the âexceptionalâ bracket of play if I go on what Sirrian has said. Iâll further assert I bet a big chunk of the average playerâs 26 matches isnât devoted to gold farming but, instead, things that interest them like guild events or Adventure Board activities. That will invite people who roll their eyes and say âwell it sounds like youâre too casualâ and yeah so? That doesnât dispute any of my points:
- After this change, people who play exceptionally will make even more than they made before.
- After this change, the average player will make less than they made before.
- This does not line up with, âItâs a good thing for the average player.â
Itâs a nerf for all but the upper crust. Thatâs why we have an argument: the primary opposition is âThis sucks for me, itâs a nerfâ, and the primary support is, âNo way it works out for me, I donât want to consider other options that might not be so good for me, maybe you should play the same way I play!â
TL;DR:
I am willing to bet an awful lot that:
- if all players who donât put in enough play to donate 4m+ gold per week quit, GoW would not last through Q3 2020.
- if all players who contribute more than 1m per week quit, GoW would continue to function with only a small change in revenue.
Thereâs power in numbers, and thatâs why I never take âb-b-but Iâm hardcore and itâs good for me!â as an answer.
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Many times in the past, some problem/update has been predicted to be a âguild killerâ and it hasnât turned out that way. But this time, killing smaller guilds is the solution people are proposing?
Our guild is almost 5 years old. Weâre not âdead.â But we donât do 30+ LTs. People have started leaving. Itâs disappointing and only time will tell if all of us eventually feel like we âhave toâ jump ship to keep up.
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Have you ever been pro- Gems of War ?
I only ask because you always seem to argue people that play more should not get more than people that play less, which seems odd to me.
Whether you play one hour or ten hours, should not be a deciding factor of fair or unfair in an always online game.
I really think we need this patch to come out, so that all this negativity can slowly move toward the next thing people believe is going to kill the gameâŚ
Having read a lot of your posts they always seem targeted at people that play a lot, if Iâm wrong Iâm sorry, but Iâm beginning to think you have a serious problem with playtime, and would love to see penalties put in place to punish those that put more time and effort into the game.
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I feel like this is a lot of people on the forums lately. While I find @Slypenslyde to be insightful and detailed with many of his posts, he and many other share a slight negative tone towards gems more often than not lately. I know this comes from a place of love for the game. If they hated it they wouldnât fight so hard for change. Not to mention some of their points are extremely valid(especially cosmetic purchases!)
Voicing concern is good and encouraged and I would hope that continues. But the negativity and resentment toward gem devs runs deep with longtime forum members(Iâm not one of them). Quiting is as free an option as playing is. No one is forcing anyone to do anything, itâs just a game in the end.
Read again, pay more attention. Iâm not seeing 500 extra gem keys each month, Iâm seeing 500 gem keys each month. Those that the first draft would have removed entirely. Like I already wrote, given the choice between
a.) 500 gem keys that allow me to reliably target a new mythic
b.) the small chance to get a random mythic
Iâd definitely pick the former. No, unfortunately âI want it all, and double on topâ isnât an option here, grow up and pick your poison.
Thereâs veteran guilds that complete all epic tasks, thereâs newbie guild that donât complete any epic tasks. And in between thereâs a huge number of other guilds that now have additional options. They can go for some epic tasks instead of basic tasks, in case they prefer the resources offered. Like extra high value keys, those are no longer locked behind completing all basic tasks.
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Does it matter? Do I have some amount of âcomplaint pointsâ that, after expending them, I have to earn back by talking positive about the game? Or could it be that you have no argument, you feel like you have to disagree with me, and youâd rather attack âthe concept that Iâm negativeâ instead of âthis change does not meet its stated goalâ?
Are there also âpositivity pointsâ? Is there some point where you will realize youâve jumped into a thread to say, âdoesnât affect me, therefore not a problemâ but have already said one too many things in support of GoW, so now you have to find something negative to say?
Why do you get to be the scorekeeper? Shouldnât it be a mod or beta tester or something?
Thatâs a mischaracterization, but close. The problem isnât âpeople arenât punished for playing too muchâ. The problem is, âThis change was said to have been made to help players who donât play a lot, but it disproportionately helps the players who do.â
Iâm not as competitive a player as I used to be. My life got a little more busy. Since then, the bar for, âWhat must you do to keep pace?â keeps rising. I complain because if it rises too much farther, I wonât be able to play for free.
People like you are still well above that bar and comfy in the knowledge you will be for a long time if not forever. Thatâs why you can enter every thread, shrug, and say, âIt wonât be the end of the gameâ. Maybe not for you, but each one of the last few major updates has been the end of the game for a group of players.
The people who play a lot shouldnât be punished. Iâm not aiming for that. Iâm pointing out rewards donât scale linearly in this game and it makes the middle-of-the-road people who make up the majority frustrated. People donât become endgamers and thus new recruits if they burn out in midgame.
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If a person is biased and partisan, I donât need to respond to their comments, as there is no point in doing so.
Thank you for acknowledging your overall opinion concerning Gems of War, and your feelings that the patch doesnât correct the imbalance created by players that play less vs the players that play more.
If you and I worked for the same company, and we both got paid the same hourly wage, and you worked 15 hours and I worked 30 in a given week, obviously I would make more. That doesnât mean the company is evil, nor do I see how the company could adjust things so that the people that work less could make the same amount as the people that work more.
If the devs suggested 4.7 would fix the above issue, I see no course of action they could have taken to do so.
If a person plays less/works less they usually have and make less, so long as all things are equal, and in Gems of War we all have the same opportunities to play as little, or as much as we want.
But I digress, if you are as biased concerning Gems of War (and those that play more) as suggested by your posts, there is nothing I can say that wonât result in another version of you explaining how unfair and rigged the system is to early/mid game players, and those that canât or donât play much.
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I think what Sly is concerned about is that wage by time isnât strictly handled in a linear way in GoW. Going by your example, if you worked for 30 hours in a given week you would get paid four times as much as someone who worked for 15 hours. Due to the way gold donations get amplified within guilds.
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In which playing GoW is compared to doing paid work. OUCH!!
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Itâs not my fault if equal opportunity is something hard to grasp. Everyone has the same chances and opportunities in Gems of War, especially when it comes to playtime and participation.
I only used work and pay as an equatable format to playtime and the rewards granted based on participation.
More work at an hourly rate equals more pay. More playtime and participation in Gems of War, as with most games, equals more rewards.
I know I must come across as rather obtuse for thinking that if I play a lot, my time and participation should be rewarded⌠but alas, since there are those arguing that 4.7 was allegedly going to address less participation equalling more rewards, I know not what else to add.
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Ha, I knew itâd be compared to wages. Itâs really a false equivalence though.
See, when we work for wages itâs assumed itâs a free market and that we negotiate our wage beforehand. I knew Iâd make $x per hour, I knew youâd make $x per hour, so itâs perfectly fair that if your hours > my hours then your wage > my wage. Thereâs a linear connection here and itâs the simplest math to work out.
But wages are different than our incomes in GoW. I donât pay my employer money when I arrive at work. If they tried to tell me I need to pay a âmeeting sigilâ or I canât attend a meeting, Iâd cackle with glee and return to my desk and they could have their dumb meeting without me. Every week, GoW puts a troop up for sale with Glory. 3 weeks out of the month, thereâs event sigils to buy with gems. Thereâs a bounty troop. There are new factions. Thereâs a new Mythic. Thereâs a new Legendary. All of these things cost resources to get. The only reason to get them is they might be required to maintain your income.
Now, thereâs nothing new about a game with entry fees. I paid $15/week for a long time to draft MtG. Pay to play is straightforward and honest.
GoW doesnât have an entry fee. But all the stuff I get in return for playing represents currency I use to make progress. Failing to get enough to beat the RNG and get a crucial mythic can have devastating consequences for a player. Answer me seriously: do you think youâd still be in competitive shape next year if you stopped opening chests or spending in-game currency until then? Do you think youâd get to stay in your current guild if some new meta-defining troops showed up and you didnât get them?
Iâm fine with not seeing eye-to-eye with you re: âhow much play is appropriate?â. When I was younger I put 14+ hours into games some days. Iâd say I regret it but I know myself well: if you put me in a time machine and warped me back Iâd giggle and think, âWow, now I can play DIFFERENT games that I missed while I was playing the ones I played the first time.â
But see eye to eye with me on this: I used to feel like GoW set the bar really low on the effort it took to F2P and feel âcompetitiveâ. 2019 has been a year that inched that bar upwards every month. You play far above my level and itâll be a long time before you even notice the bar. That doesnât change that the barâs at my chin. I scaled back my GoW play a little. GoW has scaled up its expectations a lot. I donât like that one bit, and that your lifestyle fits GoW doesnât affect whether mine does. It did, and I donât want that part to change.
I want to play the game to have fun. I donât want to play the game because I need resources to keep having fun. Thatâs just a really complex version of the stamina system we praise them for ânot havingâ.
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Because of the way the game is currently set, only GW would be affected by this. I play free and have been in a top guild for many months. I play one pvp team and it works great. New mythics dont affect that. Mythics donât affect explore which you can now get trophies in. So really what am I missing by not getting a new mythic? Also, you can still get that mythic later in crafting as a guarantee instead of the rare key chance.
Falling out of a high level guild has nothing to do with troops(unless your guild only cares about how you do in GW, which ours doesnât). Its all about gold/trophies/events which can all obtained with any number of teams, most easy to obtain.
At the core, this is seems like a personal time issue for you. As a F2P who plays at a high level, I donât feel like i have to keep up with the game at all. I know for you it feels that way but that may be because your time in the game is much less than you thought. You get what you put into gems. And if you arenât happy with the game at your pace, I would def consider a new game. Thatâs honestly not meant to be harsh at all, I encourage anyone to do the same. Donât play a game thatâs not fun for you. Because this game wont be moving backwards to accommodate.
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Well, youâre missing 2 points in your post. The first is you canât buy the bounty/raid/invasion troops either. Thatâs the spending currency part. Iâm sure you just accidentally missed that part of the question instead of changing my question to an easier one to answer.
All well and good and Iâm on the way, but the point youâre missing is loud and clear in my posts:
- GoW wasnât always like this.
- I liked it when it wasnât.
- Iâm asking for it to continue to be how I like instead of changing more in the direction of, âshrug No skin off my back, why donât you quit if you canât play hardcore like me?â
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Note at this point Iâm not even specifically complaining about Epic Tasks, which the players have advanced to âIâm used to itâ on.
Iâm complaining about the next four resource nerfs that will arrive by the end of next year. Donât believe me? Check back.
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This is exactly how I feel the progression of the game has gone. This trend is not new.
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Lol, how would those matter in any sense of progression or ability to play in a high level guild? Maybe read my comment thoroughly through. I answered your direct question. High level guilds have NOTHING to do with troops. Its gold/trophies almost exclusively and any player with mang could complete events out even without troop purchasing.
Players longing for the past are going to be continually disappointed and disgruntled by the updates, direction the devs and the game takes, and thus youâll never be satisfied. Do many of these changes suck for F2P sure, but as we saw with the stream last night there was more to 4.7 than epic tasks, or LT nerfing to affect your personal play.
Honestly, I donât pay to play so whether the devs force me out overtime by pushing currency nerfs or revert back to an old save, it really doesnât matter to me in the slightest. If I do lose time to play Iâll just drop down and play casually, knowing full well all i need to do to get back to a high level guild is just play more(gold/trophies).
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Amazing! The next nerf took less than 24 hours.
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Same nerf. Anyone who didnât think ânew gold sinkâ wouldnât be paired with âoh also we forgot to tell you we adjusted gold rewardsâ hasnât been playing GoW long enough to have expected to afford ETs anyway.
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