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[TECHNICALLY NOT A BUG] Daily offer doesn't do what it says it does

Platform, device version and operating system: Steam, Windows 10

Screenshot or image:

What you were expecting to happen, and what actually happened:

Offer states: ‘Help Wild Plains towards Power Level 20’.

Expectation: Buying the offer helps Wild Plains towards Power Level 20.

Reality: Wild Plains is not being helped towards Power Level 20. No amount of ultra-rare or upconverted-from-ultra-rare ingots will progress Wild Plains. I have enough ingots several times over.

Suggested fix: Adjust offer description to reflect reality or rework offer.

Let’s not argue semantics and claim this is technically not a bug but an offer with looooots of foresight…

6 Likes

Just wanted to know:

How many of 12 Wild Plains weapons are you missing ?
Because I currently got 10… 1 of them is Doomed, other 9 can be upgraded with ingots…

Hey Sytro,

Please read what I wrote:

No amount of ultra-rare or upconverted-from-ultra-rare ingots will progress Wild Plains. I have enough ingots several times over.
…claim this is technically not a bug but an offer with looooots of foresight

So i guess, you got enough weapons and resources to upgrade those weapons…

Guess, you’ll be stuck with this offer for some time…

1 Like

[TECHNICALLY NOT A BUG]

10chars.

Daily Deal offers are based solely on the type of kingdom upgrade requirement. In your screenshot, that requirement is a weapon upgrade requirement. The game is coded to offer ingot deals in response that kingdom upgrade requirement. That’s all there is to it. I know that’s the point that you are trying to make here.

Salty has said multiple times on stream that it is not technically feasible to do a full analysis of each player’s account on every daily reset (the amount of sheer processing power needed would crush the servers), hence the over-simplistic approach that the devs decided to use when creating the Daily Deal system. That decision is highly unlikely to change in the future. Also there is next to zero chance that the system will ever offer doomed scrolls or missing weapons as part of a Daily Deal offer.

Wild Plains is next due for a visit on the 15th of March (subject to change). Craft the epic kingdom weapon that week to obtain your missing weapon and clear the weapon upgrade requirement for Power 20.

1 Like

Let’s be honest, that’s more an excuse to avoid recognizing they did a hasty, poor implementation of this feature and have no plans to invest resources to rework it. There are lots of ways around the issue presented, like having the game clients running the actual maths upon first daily login, then negotiating with the server the daily offers that should be presented, passing as argument a list of the ones that should be excluded from the pool. It most likely requires more programming, but at the benefit of presenting more relevant offers, relieving servers from some load (and imagine if they’re currently pre-generating offers for all accounts, even those not logging in for that day!), and ultimately increasing revenues by having more people spending gems to buy useful stuff.

5 Likes

Technically not a bug, but you will get offers to level troops when you have them all leveled and not medalled.

I guess technically this is just laziness. I think that is a far more accurate description of it.

2 Likes

Maybe, maybe not.

From what has been said publicly on-stream, to me it sounds like the devs went for the most cost economical route when designing the system. They may have run a cost/benefit analysis for a more complex implementation and someone up the executive ladder might have made the call that it was not worth the development costs. That’s something us, as players, will likely never know.

(emphasis added by me)

The bolded part will almost surely never happen. I can say that with 99.9% confidence.

The moment the game client is in control of the math behind anything, that opens the door wide open for hacking and injections. The devs would never allow the potential for a hacked or compromised client to negotiate with the servers.

That logic only works if players are actually spending real money to buy those gems.

Given the nature of the majority of the audience on these forums, most of us here are dedicated late to end-gamers with highly developed accounts who collect tributes many times a day. It is not that implausible for these accounts to collect over 200-250+ gems per day for free (a $20 USD value by in-game shop standards). So, if a dedicated player is earning $20 USD of gems per day in-game, what are the odds that those players are spending real money on additional gems? Outside of maybe the daily gems subscription, virtually zero for most people in this grouping although there are some big spenders out there.

Not-so-spoiler alert: That’s why the game is moving more towards real money transactions over purchasing things with gems.The devs want sell things that generate revenue. Buying things with massive amounts of free gems from hourly tributes do not generate revenue for the devs. Also, that’s why the Elite campaign pass is not purchasable with gems.

Known and very well documented issue at this point. Crossing fingers this is fixed in 5.4.

5 Likes

That’s a good place for abusing, anything client-side sends to server can by manipulated by 3rd party program.

ok, so a 3rd party program will exclude anything other that imperial deed offer… daily

Fair points that should be surely took into account, but that can also certainly be prevented through adequate server validation, e.g. the request could include the starting numbers for the formula used to rule off a certain offer (worst case, the server validates again if the offer is being rightfully excluded). It will still require some computation server side, but:

  1. You would only run these checks on demand upon client connection (far lesser population than the total number of accounts, with connections naturally spread over the course of the day).
  2. You would only validate offers being ruled off, without having to go through each possible one, which is the bulk of processing required.

That’s my impression as well, and most likely what happened. My point is don’t come at me with an excuse, trying to convince me it cannot be done. Just be transparent, state you chose not to proceed that way, and explain why. Heck, if your explanation is good more and more people would probably even agree with you, and the player base would stop complaining over and over about the same feature.

5 Likes

There’s also the option to modify user interaction. Currently, daily offers roll up a category, then pick a random one from within the category. Like throwing legendary ingots at you when you are at best short of epic ingots. More player friendly ways to do this:

1.) Show the category that was rolled up (e.g. ingots), clicking on it allows the players to purchase any one of all the offers belonging to this category (e.g. a single ultra-rare, epic, legendary or mythic ingot offer).
2.) Show the category that was rolled up (e.g. ingots), clicking on it does a deeper profile inspection that locks in an offer of that category that is still needed (e.g. epic ingots). This distributes the potential server load over the whole day.

4 Likes

it is not technically feasible to do a full analysis of each player’s account on every daily reset (the amount of sheer processing power needed would crush the servers)

(Genuinely not sure how serious above statement is.)

I think PART of the reason why people have become so hostile towards the developers is the light in which official communication keeps painting the team.

Everything (no matter how trivial) is:

  • incredibly hard to implement
  • incredibly hard to fix
  • requires incredible amounts of computing power
  • requires incredible amounts of developer time
  • up to the parent company controlling every microscopic detail at I2

And when pressed, everyone is:

  • too overworked and in need of a holiday
  • out of the office right now

This is the only type of official communication on the forums with regards to the game and its systems. Salty has been preaching the same lines for a long time and I think it’s not surprising people started believing her and the picture she paints of the team. It’s not a positive one :frowning:

over-simplistic approach that the devs decided to use when creating the Daily Deal system

The game needs to be aware of a wealth of information with regards to your account’s status at all times on the server’s side and for much of the time on the client’s side. The game needs to know how many stars to put on the map for each kingdom. It needs to know the status of every single requirement for your next (power) level when you click a kingdom to start an explore run. Every time you head into battle the game must adjust your stats according to your troops’ elite status, their parent kingdom’s current level, your pets, modifiers from the campaign and your guild’s completed tasks, weekly buffs, your equipped medals and so on and on. Adjusting your troops might well be calculated on your device. Everything else must already be stored (hopefully in some precomputed form for some items) on the server. A better deal system doesn’t require crazy amounts of extra computing power, it requires developer attention, more offers and additional conditions to check for.

Buying things with massive amounts of free gems from hourly tributes do not generate revenue for the devs

Not disagreeing, but why alienate current players by excluding them from another system when potential fixes require (almost certainly) very little developer time? Payblocked systems like campaigns and elite levels for mythics become even less attractive when the game is flipping its ultra rare ingot laden middle finger of a daily deal at me 23 out of 30 days in a month.

Again, I’d never buy emojis. Put them on rotation. They’re still infinitely more relevant.

The moment the game client is in control of the math behind anything, that opens the door wide open for hacking and injections.
That’s a good place for abusing, anything client-side sends to server can by manipulated by 3rd party program.

Slightly offtopic: Doesn’t the game do precisely that? Start a battle, disconnect your internet. You can continue playing just fine (for that battle). The client is in full control of logic & math no? The server might verify your moves after the fact, or it might not and is wide open to cheating.

2 Likes

I’m confused as to why the Ingots offered are (apparently always?) Ultra-Rare. There’s only one Ultra-Rare weapon from Wild Plains – Crossbow of Exile. Have you upgraded this one, @sls? Doesn’t the game normally offer Ingots based on the rarity of a non-fully-upgraded weapon?

There are some cash-only weapons in Wild Plains, Bullroarer and Staff of the Wild (yet to appear in the Soulforge), so sls may not have these, and I could understand the game thinking it’s being helpful if it were to offer Ingots for these (even if that would be dumb), but both of those weapons are Epic-rarity.

If the game can’t offer Forge Scrolls for an un-upgraded Doomed Weapon, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to ask that it be excluded from offers rather than offering Ultra-Rare ingots, if that’s the default.

There’s plenty of people that actually buy gems, even in the mid-late game. I’ve known, met, and seen the type of people that will. Not everyone is a min/maxer and not everyone has time to collect hourly tribute with full time jobs (on console at least… probably not professional for phone users as well). Others are retired and have time and money to spare for the sake of convenience.

If the forums are going to be considered the vocal minority in regards to opinions, so too should their spending habits, gaming habits and tribute collecting habits be considered the minority.

It doesn’t only apply when its convenient.

5 Likes

That’s a fair assessment to present, and I agree with you.

That said, I would strongly doubt that the devs do not consider the potential amount of “free” gem income that can enter the game when determining which items can be purchased with gems and for what price amounts. Pricing in the Daily Deals shop is designed to funnel excess gems out of the game’s economy.

Thanks, @Jonathan. That got me curious and I dug a bit further.

Here’s my owned Wild Plains weapons:

Here’s my unowned WP weapons:

The lowest rarity unowned weapon is of epic quality.

This got me thinking: Maybe I should have a look at all my weapons and their upgrade status



So every single one of the 20 ultra rare weapons I own is at max level.

But how many ultra weapons are there in total and how many am I missing?

[[ drumroll ]]

image

I’m missing … one.

Makes the entire ingot offer seem even more silly.

2 Likes