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Lycanthropy temporarily removed from essence of evilfrom

I was ready to forget this weapon until this…please don’t update the weapon anymore. The only update we need for the weapon is to be able to remove some updates to it.

2 Likes

+1 for this should be a permanent change, also these:

Unless there is somehow an implementation of Lycanthropy where the transformed troop retains all of its status effects inflicted beforehand (which seems highly unlikely, considering this is part of the point of transforming in every way it has existed prior), Lycanthropy has no place being bundled with “random” OR “all” status effects, be they negative OR positive, because it actively works against the very point of inflicting said effects.

Wait, really? If so, I’m actually hoping this was a mistake. The last time (bleed I believe) new status effects were added, they initially tacked them on after Curse, and Curse was intentionally moved to the last thing inflicted afterward as a bugfix to keep this design consistency. Part of the counters to EoE was that it needed a cast to curse an Impervious which could still be cleansed by an outside source if the turn dropped (including by a medal since they aren’t stunned yet), then needing another full cast to lock them out fully. This then counter-balanced by the critical caveat and core mechanic that turn based (not medal) auto-cleanse does not ever trigger on the turn any status was inflicted on that particular target, so any target you lock down with EoE that doesn’t have another cleanse source on the team will remain locked down for at least the next turn.

I’d hate to end up with, when this is considered “resolved”, an even more potent initial cast EoE that just ignores the previous soft counter that we had but will still intermittently randomly fail to do its job and blow up in your face because Lycanthopy. Seems like the worst of both worlds.

7 Likes

If Lycanthropy is added back to Essence of Evil then it was and is a nerf to the weapon.
Having Essence of Evil curse first is a buff to the weapon.

So no, bad dev, keeping curse first, and adding Lycanthropy back would not be “a balancing out” of the weapon. 🤦

Clearly taking Lycanthropy out of Weapons isn’t that much of an issue. So a great compromise would be to take it out of all Random status effect weapons.
(I understand you did EoE because that was the biggest out cry leading to the most game breaking bugs. But it’s not the only weapon capable of casting it.)
And if you want to keep it in the troops then it’s whatever.

But keep in mind. You managed to make Delve runs EVEN MORE DIFFICULT. Due to one of the most difficult Factions, Dark Pits, having a faction troop that can cast Lycanthropy.
Sure it’s possible that the AI can transform a worthless Faction troop into a decent beast troop. Much more likely a level 500 AI troop almost dead, will transform and be fully healed into a level 500 Mythic beast troop though.

So the community has managed to make a pretty overwhelming cons list when it comes to Lycanthropy’s existence as a whole.

What exactly are the pros? 🤷

7 Likes

Can we go a moment without GW’s referencing thing’s. Ergh…

Hugs to the team for the quick bandaid. It needs a deeper look, but this case was the big one and kudos for acting on it rather quickly. Seriously. This doesn’t solve the problem across the board but it hits the big issue while it gets figured out. Feels like good faith to me! Bravo!

1 Like

The change to EoE was intended, as we felt it improved the weapon. We will be keeping the order that the weapon now applies status effects, however, when Lycanthropy is fixed it will be added back to EoE.

You win some, you lose some!

6 Likes

Thank you for the info,
nevertheles, I can’t say I agree.

Essence was already a very powerful weapon and applying curse first makes it easily overpowereed.

Edit.
For ordinary PvP context, at least, having Lycanthropy on Essence hardly matters - the game almost always is over before it triggers (well, for the team I use), but it’s the general principle concerning this new status effect, as discussed above and before, that makes this situation feel iffy and disagreeable.

4 Likes

Lol… So basically I called it then.

So the Hero classes that were immune to Lycanthropy and somewhat protected from Essence. (You know balanced.)
Just have a useless 100 Talent (Fortitude) now.

Why does your guy’s screw up cost the players even more protection from a mechanic that everyone that actually plays the game agrees ruins your game in it’s current implementation?

Y’all should help protect us from StockenWolf™. Not make a big announcement about removing Lycanthropy temporarily. Then make no mention of changing how Essence of Evil will work while you’re at it. (In the middle of guild wars week.)
But once folks notice say yep… That’s the cost of the temporary removal.

Unless I’m completely misreading your comment since “it” can be misconstrued.

I read it as though Curse will be applied first so Impervious troops will have all negative status effects from one cast of Essence of Evil. Even when you add Lycanthropy back to Essence of Evil.

8 Likes

At least Salty agrees, Lycanthropy is bad.

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Why should players be losing? games are meant to be fun and shouldn’t you want to make the game as fun as possible for the majority of the player base. These forums have been very negative for a long time you really should be doing whatever it takes to make your players happy if it doesn’t negatively affect the game or your profits.

10 Likes

Yeah, agreed that this feels kind of weird. I mean, acting and communicating about the temporary fix was a yay/good thing :white_check_mark:, but then as you’ve said, the permanent change to the order in which EoE applies status effects got no mention. It’s good to now have the clarification, but still…

6 Likes

It is a gigantic longshot but is there any possibility to find out what was the intention when adding Lycanthropy to “negative status effects” basket (even more so when there are delve troops capable of randomly applying it)? There surely must’ve been a vision on what Lycanthropy is supposed to accompmish and how it should enhance the gaming experience and make players want to use it?

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I’m also very concerned that most players seem to already hate lycanthropy ( it IS broken as it is and definitely not a “negative” effect) and you seem to be planning a big update around that mechanic. Please please please don’t, for once listen to the feedback.

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This really isn’t a win+lose situation, EoE just became hands down the most powerful defensive weapon in the game with literally no contest. It breaks fortitude and invulnerability which is a HUGE power creep and then if lycanthropy pops it messes with team composition.

On the other hand in attack it’ll be stupid strong for pvp and completely worthless on high level delves because a 1hp EoE’d unit transforming into a full health and armoured level 400+ unit is straight hell on earth.

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You make Zuul worthless with this EoE’s change … what a shame. Are you against your clients or do you ‘work’ for them ? It’s not clear for me.

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As someone who is actually playing this game every day, it sounds like we lose some and then we lose some more.

Others have said it well already. Curse first renders many troop traits useless which will mostly affect pvp and GW.

I’m not sure you guys actually know what you’re doing with this.

Yes, it makes the weapon stronger but it didn’t need to be stronger at all.

It also makes a lot of troops and teams weaker.

And lycanthropy, even if it makes enemy troops weaker which I hope it will when reworked is not something I’d actually want to have on eoe.

If you want to do something with that weapon and make it better, replace the last trait with something else or let us remove upgrades we made that are detrimental.

Try making players happy. You’d be surprised, I’m sure, how well that would go.

10 Likes

R.I.P. impervious and bless.

2 Likes

Oh cool, let me go ahead and update my Tier list then for weapons…

Weapon Color Bonus Magic Weapon Name Weapon Rank
Green Essence of Evil S++
Purple Fiend Fire A
Blue Orb of Winter A
Purple Reflection of Good A
Brown Skeleton Key A
Purple Creeping Death B
Purple Crypt Keeper B
Yellow Dancing Daggers B
Brown Dragon’s Eye B
Green Fire Ruby Staff B
Blue Plunder and Peril B
Brown Runeforger B
Blue Serve and Protect B
Brown Shield of Urskaya B
Yellow Staff of St. Astra B
Red Deathdealer C
Brown Dragonator 8000 C
Yellow Orpheus’ Lute C
Purple Sins’ Harvest C
Yellow Spiked Manriki C
Green Summer’s Wonder C
Blue Thorodin C
Yellow Thunderbird C
Red Flame Soul D
Red Orc King’s Club D
Red Serpentine Dagger D
Green Spider Totem D
Purple Staff of Visions D
Blue Symbol of Anu D
Blue Three Sisters D
Red Warlord’s Battlecry D
Purple Daemonomicon F
Green Dragon Oak F
Brown Warden’s Gauntlets F

You took an A tier weapon and made it INSANE. The only troops in the game now that aren’t completely shut down by EoE on one cast are troops with Invulnerable (Enraged Kurandara and Dooms). And while I’m speaking on that – there is nothing in the actual text that says Invulnerable is immune to curse. Both Invulnerable and Impervious say immune to all status effects. But only Invulnerable is immune to curse as well.

Instead of making a godly weapon even better, you should maybe focus on all the other trash weapons.

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…I can’t be the only one who sees that the only reason they changed the way Curse works with EoE was to take the Heat off how shit Lycanthropy is.

I feel like y’all are assuming Lycanthropy is off EoE for good. Once it returns, EoE becomes Trash again due to the fact that you’re basically making every troop you cast on an impervious troop anyway.

So don’t buy into the magicians misdirection folks. Calling EoE OP or Godlike is basically begging them to nerf something that they already nerfed, unnerfed, made OP and have every intention to nerf again.

If or when they decide to keep Lycanthropy off EoE for good. Then this mind frank of curse first can be addressed.

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Down with lycanthropy!!

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