That’s just what I’m pointing out though. After those 8+ months that newbie won’t just have a single kingdom reaching 8+ viability, it will be most kingdoms almost at the same time, because they tend to grow in power at roughly an equal pace. 64 legendaries allow unblocking one kingdom, maybe two, then it’s another 8+ months for the next one. Being hard-capped on almost all of your kingdoms, especially when already qualifying for multiple higher-up kingdom requirements, can’t possibly go down well. I don’t think doubling the natural drop rate will help, that’s like spitting at a forest fire considering the number of legendaries needed.
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I think EVERYONE understands this for what it is, but the official communication of the change came across as PR nonsense, or spin.
I greatly miss Sirrians posts on this forum. I could be wrong, but feel he wouldn’t have been so disingenuous when discussing the upcoming Kingdom Power change and why.
for the future
- Economy changes must be approved, hence they need to be very reasonable.
- 5 Free Legendary Ingots per day?!? This was a joke right?
Well the question here really is, if that mythic Ingot drop is a lottery win, or according to statistical expectations. So far i didn’t see many posts (just that one really, but i am not exactly scanning the forums for that kind of thing) of people looting mythic Ingots and i’d imagine that is something people would want to share similar to people sharing how they got a released mythic with statistically low investments of resources.
Anyways i agree with you on having to wait and see to get a clearer picture of how many significant Ingots(legendary+) will be lootable in time, before we rush to judgement on this.
Actually no, from a technical point of view it’s one of several possible solutions to the issue at hand. Of course I don’t expect them to go for that approach, then again I also didn’t expect them to require us to collect well above 2k Legendary Ingots to get our kingdoms to 8 stars.
Warning, weird developer reasoning ahead for more insight. From gut feeling, the way the game is growing it probably shouldn’t take a highly active player more than a year to reach 8 stars. That’s roughly 50 weeks for roughly 2000 Legendary Ingots, meaning roughly 40 Legendary Ingots each week. PvP will get that player roughly 1 Legendary Ingot each week, so the other 39 Legendary Ingots have to to come from somewhere. 7 * 5 daily Legendary Ingots = 35 Legendary Ingots, that still leaves 4 Legendary Ingots unaccounted for, e.g. from events.
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The new system is unfair because it makes it harder (or in some cases impossible) for newer players to get where veterans allready are.
If it was possible to get a specific kingdom to level 9 just by leveling and traiting troops they should have kept it that way for that specific kingdom and add the new restrictions (weapons, pets, classes…) for the levels after level 9.
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Upgrading all weapons is LITERALLY impossible. Every raid and invasion has a new weapon so almost every week another 45 legendary ingots needed. Not to mention all the current ones.
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The person who has it claimed they spent 15 hours grinding. I think that has something to do with why you haven’t seen very many posts. I reckon that means everyone has to specifically grind 30-50 hours before we get a feeling for if that’s “a good measure”.
Then what do you expect? It’s not fair to throw out a hyperbolic answer you don’t believe in and attack people for calling it dumb. Ask for something reasonable.
But I think it all hinges on, “How fast I think kingdoms should be leveled to 8 stars”. Given that the devs just pushed them up to a max of like 20 stars, I’m going to be shocked if we aren’t presented with ways over the next few months to get dramatic injections of ingots.
I think it’s a flimsy assumption to think future weapons will follow the same lopsided rarity spread. Already people are complaining it’s realistic to max every common weapon in a very short amount of time. I’m looking at some facts right now:
- There aren’t very many common weapons.
- The lopsided rarity ratio makes upgrading weapons for kingdom power oppressively expensive.
- Kingdom stars go up to something ridiculous like 20.
- Lower-rarity ingots are annoyingly easy to get.
- New content releases frequently, and more weapons are promised.
I’ll be willing to bet we have a TON of low-rarity weapons releasing in the future. Each lower-rarity weapon reduces the “need” to max out higher-rarity weapons. Maxing 2 legendary weapons to get an 8th star is definitely a high cost. But we might agree it could be reasonable for the 12th or 16th star.
If I assume the devs actually want people to reach 12+ stars someday, I think it follows they probably expect we’ll have ample resources to get there.
This is a new game. It has new rules. Our ideas about how hard or easy it should be to get 8 stars may be outdated. With our current knowledge, it seems clear it’s almost impossible to 8-star every kingdom in a reasonable timeframe. But we also know we don’t know every way to get ingots and that within 4 months a new update is going to come.
So maybe we should calm down and wait to see what kind of rewards we get from gem chests, raid bosses, guild wars, etc. instead of trying to extrapolate everything from PvP drops.
That said, on a side table, I’m very bitter about something similar to what @GreyFox474 said: it’s stupid that people got an 8th star just for “being there sooner”. But this is also a very sour grapes argument: if I were six months “older” I’d probably be perfectly happy.
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That’s actually an approach I would consider fair. Move the two fully upgraded weapon requirement to 10 stars, so everybody gets to feel the pain, no exceptions. Having 1% of all players forming a closed privileged elite is just going to cause discontent, even though it does feel good belonging to it. 
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Sorry if I gave that impression, I’m really not trying to attack anybody. I’m just looking for options, somewhat similar to solving a puzzle. Some of those options might have external reasons to not deem them adequate (e.g. “Legendary Ingots surely have way too high gem equivalence value to just hand them out”), I’m trying to keep those out of the equation though.
Why would they want to ever release ANY low-rarity weapon again? For gameplay purposes, they are only needed for the very first few hero levels, so you have something to spend your mana on. By level 10, you’ll already have ditched them for something better. Kingdoms have level unlock requirements, the newer the higher. Once you are able to reach those kingdoms, you’ll have no use for low-rarity junk.
If these weapons are supposed to be a crutch to gloss over the requirements design, it’s far easier to correct the latter than to design all the weapon art and functionality.
I said this about Dawnbringer for 6 months so good luck. Part of maintaining an F2P game is ensuring there’s a paying 1% that appears accessible but requires maintenance. 
I do like the idea that “things that don’t require traiting” should’ve been relegated to beyond 9 stars, but this is kind of how it is. From our perspective, this is a “patch”. From the dev perspective, it’s clear every version is “a new game”, and the balance is set up from all viewpoints.
The problem with “ingots start at level 9” is it could also be bad for newer players. It means ingots, content that shows up in every PvP battle, has no concern for them until they’ve maxed most troops for a kingdom. That’s fairly late in the game. So the design needs ingots to be important somewhat sooner. The only real way I can see making everyone happy is to make different accounts have to accomplish different tasks, and that’s too complex.
This is where my Minecraft analogy rings really true. I remember one of the first content updates that really ticked me off was the dyes from things like Lapis Lazuli. I had a very large world I’d been working on for months, and I’d put a lot of work into it. I’d explored a very long way in every direction to find cool things. But here’s the deal with new ores: they can only appear in newly-generated chunks. So to find my first lapis lazuli, I had a choice: start a new world or go to a large amount of effort to build a Nether tunnel so I could travel quickly to the “edge” of my world and start a new base in newly-generated chunks. I didn’t like either. But for new players, it was cool, because they got all the new content right off the bat.
That’s precisely how this update feels. For a new player, the concept of a 7-star kingdom is so far away I’m pretty sure by the time they get there this won’t be a problem. It’s a very, very tall wall, but they know part of their job while playing is building ladders of increasing height. They figure they’ll get there.
But the wall had an interesting property. It is the same height taller than the tallest wall every player had built. So endgamers don’t see “oh, cool, this takes months, but I’ll see a lot of new content along the way”. Instead we see, “Ugh, this takes months, and I’ve already consumed the game’s content.”
That’s why I don’t know a good solution and I consider most dubious. Endgamers, arguably, need a rocketship to make this content much easier to ascend. But that is unfair to new players because it makes it hard if not impossible to “catch up”. My assumption is high-end raid/invasion/bounty rewards are going to involve ingot injections. I can already see really generous handouts on the PvP leaderboard. That is, probably, the intended way for endgamers to rocket ahead: use that endgamer power to “win” leaderboards.
Newer players would probably use those ingots for their primary use - upgrading weapons. And then they might actually USE those weapons.
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I feel like it’s a lost cause to expect usage of most hero weapons in PvP.
As proof, I’m going to point to the common troops. How many of those actually see use once you can build a team out of legendaries and epics? Is there any sympathy for a movement to use these commons? They’re nothing but fodder to help with kingdom power and lower the odds of getting “better” troops.
Weapons are the new troops. They’re just in a worse spot than troops because only 3 are S-rank, maybe 3 or 4 more are A-rank, and the power level of B-rank is so low there’s no reason to use it ever. So really weapons come in three flavors: powerful, good enough, and unplayable.
That was indeed a privileged elite, just not a closed one. Everybody could farm the souls required, I know quite a few players who did. I just don’t see a feasible way how you could currently farm the Legendary Ingots. You’d end up with more trophies than Anonymous has collected so far.
Well, they do still get benefits for upgrading the weapon they are using. You’ve given me an idea though, there’s another option that might work for that 8 star requirement. Kingdoms have colors associated, e.g. Red/Purple for Ghulvania. If the requirement instead was something like “Fully upgrade two Red and two Purple weapons, of any kingdom” it would be far less brutal and could even scale well for higher-up star levels.
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By the way, I started playing about 2-3 months ago. I had 7-star kingdoms for 2 weeks now. I’d still consider myself a newer player. 2 Months to hit a wall like that is most definately a problem.
edit: I looked it up, I started playing April 15th. A day before the clockwork Sphinx got released.
Once you start talking “magnitude of time needed to reach 7 stars” you enter a world where people get really judgemental. I consider myself “above average” but it took me at least 6 months to get there. That tells me you play an awful lot. OR: it means we’re talking different things. “Get one kingdom to 7 stars” is not a lofty goal. I’m talking “get the majority/all of your kingdoms to 7 stars”. That is a lofty goal, and my “at least 6 months” is my 5-star marker.
But we still can’t estimate how many ingots a player might accumulate in 2-3 months of above-average play. That’s several raids/invasions/champion/bounty events. That’s thousands of gem keys. How many ingots do those give us? We’re not sure.
So I’m kind of tired of saying it, but I think we should “wait and see”. 3 weeks from now, we’ll understand how fast the sky’s falling. Right now, we don’t know and it makes formulating a solution difficult. We’ll all feel really silly if it turns out getting dozens of legendary ingots isn’t “very hard” for an active player in a large guild.
I am at 2 7-Star kingdoms right now. The range of Stars on my Kingdoms is 1-7 Stars, with the Majority being around 4 Stars. And yes, I do play an awful lot. Point being: “the concept of a 7-Star Kingdom” is something that can be be grasped quite fast, even before 2 months of play time. Its something that - before 3.5 - could actively be persued by farming souls and traitstones (and using most of the gold to buy gold chests). If you knew what you want and how to get there it was easily scalable with play time. With the addition of ingots (and pets) as a requirement that is over. I could play 20h a day and still would not get any further.
I’m with you on the “lets wait and see”, although I’m certainly not as optimistic as you are.
I am a bit annoyed by the weapon upgrade requirements introduced as well, but after checking my kingdoms it isn’t quite as dire as I thought it might be. A lot of kingdoms did actually have one or more lower tier weapons that will be much easier to upgrade. Khaziel I noticed had 5 legendary weapons and nothing lower for me so that kingdom will be stuck at 7 a long time.
Zaejin I had at 8 stars and the requirements to go to 9 were:
Unlocked the Zaejin class 0/1. Not achievable yet
Unlock 3 Traits on 16 Zaejin troops.
Collect a pet from Zaejin.
Who knows when the Zaejin class will be released but otherwise it’ll be faster to go to 9 than to 8 stars if it just mostly takes a bunch of arcanes.
I have one kingdom at level 9 (Whitehelm). To go to 10 stars it says:
Collect 20 Whitehelm troops. Not achievable yet
Upgrade 18 Whitehelm troops to level 20. Not achievable yet
Collect a Mythic troop from Whitehelm.
So yeah I can’t even imagine getting any kingdoms to 10 star for years.
I’ve gotten a total of one Mythic from a chest and 2 orbs of ascension so far at Level 1,119.
Too Right!
I Second That!
I believe it’s new rules are tougher and there’s no way of trading to purchase gems,
e.g: swap amount of glory for amount of gems!
You can virtually purchase, swap/trade everything else on this game, bar that.
Devil
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