Is the "Backup" talent still at 35% summon chance? Discuss

Just been wondering this recently.

“Feels” more like the original 50% of late.

I don’t have a crapload of data to back this up though, maybe RNG hates me :laughing:

They should just remove the passive summon skills. Just makes pvp worse than it already is.

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Needs to be 25% at most. Orbweaver summoning spiders too.


I’ve been thinking it would help if they were somehow capped?

Since this is a trait on a hero class… They’ll NEVER change it. Unfortunately.

Well they recently changed thief from 50% to 35% after much feedback. Don’t see why we can’t get it changed again.

3 summon or resurection should be the max, the battles are getting longer because of this stupidity

Very boring having to kill 10 spider or bandit to finish every fights


That’s a good idea, I would actually take it further and make these talents a “once only” talent like some spells are.


Talents and troop traits can be changed…hero class traits not so much. Different coding for all 3…

4 bandit summons.

^^^ broken as intended.

I think the takeaway here is “35% is still 1/3 which happens more often than people believe.”

But I still reference the age-old TDS discussion that went like this:

  • TDS was supposed to have a unique trait, but the devs couldn’t finish it on time so it got a 50% (?) resurrection trait.
  • Players complained for a year+ that it procced too often. The devs pointed at “RNG” and stuck out their tongues.
  • Players asked for the new TDS trait.
  • The devs were too busy.
  • One player did an analysis that suggested the TDS resurrection was proccing at 5%, but with abnormal bias towards “streaking”. He asserted a 90% confidence that instead of picking with equal probability, it was more likely to proc 0 or 3 times in a match than 1 or 2, which suggested a very strange RNG bias.
  • By the next update the devs mysteriously decided to prioritize assigning a unique third trait to TDS.

Since then, any player who dares utter that the RNG could have a streak biased is ridiculed, because player memory is short.

So historical takeaways are:

  • The RNG is biased in that it favors streaks or misses more than it should.
    • It still hits the right probability over time. The bias only shows itself if you think radical thoughts like “3 in a row” ought to be less likely than “2 in a row” and even less likely than “1 in a row”.
    • The devs only served to reinforce this with what I call a “Trump denial”. It’s when you assert, “I could not have stolen cookies from the cookie jar because I am allergic to dairy.” and within 10 minutes have Tweeted, “Dunking Oreos with best friend and totally misunderstood Cookie Monster at a dairy farm!” with pictures.
  • Players absolutely hate summon-on-death triggers.

The worst thing about these type of summons is nobody really uses them in offense, not really. They are only used as a PITA defense.

I’m on the lonely island of believing Thief is the best class in the game. Bandit does come in handy on offense. But when it does, it still feels broken. :man_shrugging:


Yeah, I used it for a Raid Boss once (when it was 50%) with Trickster’s Shot, and it just felt like cheating.

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I think Orbweavers trait should be higher. I would be happy with 20% on talents and 25% on Orbweaver.