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Guild Wars, Point-Scoring for Battles, and You!

I’m sorry, I thought you were the one claiming to have a formula, or rather, saying that the formula must be random.

My point, which I think @delinquent was agreeing with, is that the devs would not introduce a random element into scoring and it is more likely that one or more assumptions about the inputs to the formula are incorrect, leading to your conclusion that the results are random.

The only formula I play GW by is to get it over with as quickly and painlessly as possible. That hasn’t changed in the last three weeks.

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This thread is starting to do my head in. How do I mute it? I genuinely don’t know.

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Just below this post, you’ll see a thing that says “tracking”, with a blue dot. Click that and then select “muted” or “normal” and you should be good.

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Thanks mate. Cheers.

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I might have misunderstood, then.

So we all agree :smiley: I’ll move myself to the corner :sweat_smile:

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The following applies to the game played on PC/Steam only. I can’t attest for the numbers on other versions of the game. Tests were run on August 3 at about 12 p.m. PST over the course of a < 10 minute span.

I used this team on purple day to run some tests:
image

I had a good starting board every single game, so I was able to use the Mercy opener, which is why this data is so consistent. I won every single game easily. I took three damage in one game from a Famine trait, and zero in all others - my damage ratio is maxed out. I allowed 7 mana to be collected one game, and 0 every other, while collecting at least four times that in every game - my mana ratio was most certainly maxed out. My troops weren’t scratched except from a single famine hit on life, so I didn’t lose or summon any troops, so my troop bonus had to be maxed out. Total actions taken were 7, 10, 9, 11, and 10, respectively. Total scores were 1329, 1320, 1323, 1317, and 1320. If the formula is correct as given, we should be able to reasonably conclude that B% is 1% - in other words, every action less than 30 is a bonus of 1% to your base score. We know that all the bonuses are additive now, because it is spelled out in the original post. Therefore, we can stop thinking about bonuses in percentage terms and start thinking about them in terms of total points. Each action under 30 actions taken is worth 3 points each. This is a potential of 87 total points, (since it would be impossible to win without taking an action).

We have also been told that color bonus calculation has not changed. We know from before the changes that each correctly colored troop is worth 50% of the base score (with level 100+ statues), therefore each correctly colored troop is worth 150 points, for a potential of 600 points.

We are given 300 points for a win, displayed right there in the GW screen, so we already know that.

Extrapolating from my data set and assuming the formulas given in the original post currently are correct, on the battles where I earned 1320 points, I earned 450 points for correct color troop colors, 300 for winning, and 60 for speed. That is a total of 810 points accounted for. For the other bonuses, which according to the criteria given I should have been given perfect marks according to the criteria as outlined, that leaves 510 points for remaining troops, damage ratio, and mana ratio. Given the consistency of my scores, I’d say I did earn perfect marks here.

While everyone else is trying to figure the ratio between those, I’d like to point out that under this formula with the information given, the maximum possible achievable score for any given battle should be 1497 points (300 base + 600 colors + 510 survival/damage/mana + 87 speed). Since every bonus is additive, and every bonus has a cap, every score should fall completely within this model. With the formulas and criteria all given, its just basic algebra at that point. Anything above 1500 points does not fit the model given and is anomalous.

Given that we’ve seen scores higher than that reported after Tuesday, either my math is incorrect (could be, so correct me if I’m wrong) my data is incorrect (I recorded four of five of the games I got this data from and watched them several times, there were almost no variables given I barely let the AI do anything, highly unlikely), something in the initial data is incorrect (the formula itself, the assumption that color bonus calculation are unchanged, etc.), another assumption is incorrect (there are different calculations in different versions of the game and the scores we reported are from other versions, unbounded scoring or min/max reversal bugs still exist in other versions, etc), or there is still a bug in the calculation somewhere.

I’d be interested in any recordings that could be provided of games where the user scored over 1500 points and/or what platform these users played those games on.

Overall, what I have to say about this whole thing that I’ve been mostly silent on so far is that all these tweaks and data collecting are costing dev time to get people to like a feature that they may not fundamentally like in the first place just because they feel obligated to play as to not “let down” their guild and because an exclusive reward is locked behind it. If Guild Wars troops can be reasonably mythiced through crafting and when it is no longer basically required to get a mythic on exclusive week to have an even close to reasonable chance to obtain it, many people wont care what the scoring criteria is because Guild Wars will be moved into the optional category and played only by people that actually enjoy it and not because it is tied heavily into the main collection mechanic of the game. I know a lot of time was spent on guild wars in the first place, but some people are just not going to like it - fundamentally. It was never going to be a something for everyone mode. Attempts at greater mass appeal and trying to stir up some variety by obfuscating the scoring system seem to instead be frustrating people on both sides of the fence while doing absolutely nothing for variety (and certainly not long term variety). I’m hoping we can just fix up all the actual bugs here and move on to crafting, hopefully getting those that like guild wars to play it, and giving those that don’t other options to reach the same collection goals (albeit with probably considerably more effort).

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Glad that the revised point system is so complex that must make it very important since it’s garnered a 620 post about it on one thread along

Then if it is so important - fix the bug in GW that people are having their wins recorded as losses and loosing those points.

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That happened to one of our players today. Got rematched against the same Justice team then lost for real and then a 3rd time. She was not happy.

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I don’t blame her. I’m totally irked about last night’s no point win that was counted as a loss.

Almost every week since GW been around I’ve had at least one battle that is a Win marked as a loss.
I’ve had other bugs as well, that were nothing I could do but file report and hope.
I’ve had it miscount 4 wins and make so I can’t do the 5th battle.
I think I have had based on my tracking 4 weeks in all where I didn’t have a problem.

Happened to one of my members on Tuesday, then again to another on Wednesday :unamused:

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Been happening since first week of gw. Happened to me on the first week and 4th week of gw.
Hope to see it fixed soon and guild statue bonus would be nice.

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One of my guild mates can out do everyone. Yesterday he went 5/0, on color, only loosing 1 troop the entire day. Total points for the day earned = 0. Scoreboard 0/5.

That takes skill or badly glitched to earn 0.

I’ll go with the latter since it happened to me once as well. 5 wins, 0-5, 0 points.

You’ll have that!

I’ve just thought of another mana generation clarification we need. If my troops are silenced, does the mana from the matches I make get counted?

So the mana generation questions are: (as far as I know)

Does mana from matches/cascades or explsions for colors we don’t use get counted?
Does mana from matches/cascades or explosions for troops that are already charged get counted?
Does mana from matches and cascades get counted when troops are silenced?
Does mana from spell effects like Dwarven Gate and Queen Ysabelle get counted?
Does mana drain subtract from the mana already counted?

@Saltypatra, @Sirrian,

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a lot have changed:

previously - you had to worry about winning & and meeting certain battle conditions

now - you cant make any sense of battle conditions so all you need to worry about is winning

to me its a degradation of competiveness, a huge one

that confirms it, they have taken away gw competitiveness aspect and left just a “false impression” of competitiveness

there is no competition in lottery drawing

i would rather assume they did, after all they did discredit the most common tactic of usuing and creating extra turns and not allowing enemy to play, same with instakills,
at least it has some reasonign behind it: trying to “simplify” already complicated formula so excluding exceptions :stuck_out_tongue:

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I am extremely happy with my score today 7,099. Mostly got around 1400 points per battle today, for using 4 daily colored troops. :dancer:

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Purple day: 6,9xx, 4 colored troops, 5 perfect fights

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Excellent research. :+1:

I’ve got some other data to run this against, pulled from various sources within this thread. Sorry for not giving the authors credit, I copied it to notepad to tinker around with, I don’t know who originally contributed it. :sweat:

All matches used 4 troops of the day’s colour, all matches were finished with all troops alive
Match 1: 1452 - Turns 8 Mana 102:25 Damage 366:18
Match 2: 1364 - Turns 16 Mana 241:47 Damage 541:13
Match 3: 1401 - Turns 20 Mana 266:86 Damage 476:274
Match 4: 1412 - Turns 15 Mana 235:34 Damage 480:0
Match 5: 1412 - Turns 9 Mana 184:25 Damage 555:45

Very close, not quite a match though. It can’t just be explained with an incorrectly recorded turn count, adding a multiple of 3 won’t reach 1500. It’s also worth to note that match 2 is unexpectedly low and match 3 unexpectedly high.

Used another looper team for brown day. 1 game AI had zero turns again. scored 1470 so they fixed something from yesterday but still feel like I was punished for a perfect game.

That’s pretty much spot on, prefect result, 10 actions taken for 1500 - 10*3 = 1470 points.

Here’s the my scores with the double kraken team All 4 troops survived, 3 green. Last battle won in one turn got second lowest point total!
1323
1552
1326
1203
1260

Last battle fist for perfect score, at least 30 actions taken. All the others also look reasonable, except the second one. Maybe a typo? 1252 would work.

i used a all purple loop team
got a perfect run. they had one turn for 3 mana and death doing two damage. scored 1455.
next game run was a lot lot worse and still got 1455.
final battle got smacked a little bit. dark manacles for 41 damage on all and lead troop reduces to three health by skulls. got 1360

First one would be a perfect win in 15 actions. Second one would still be a perfect win in 15 actions, even though it was a lot lot worse. Third one lost surprisingly few points considering the damage received, it might have been a fairly fast fight though.

@peterix has also been doing some recoding and might want to check numbers.

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5 wins, last battle lost two troops to that bloody pain in the arse, Wisp. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye::rofl:

1,473
1,441
1,403
1,440
1,281

Total = 7,038

All green team of:

Dark Maiden
Sylvanimora
Krystenax
Wulfgarok

Match 2,3 and 5 included devours.
Match 1 was against a single untraited Wulfgarok.

Match 2 devoured 60HP, the other two were around 10HP I think.

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