Guild Wars Change Suggestions

Official News
101

Most of these changes will make guild wars easier. How does that help with those that currently feel frustrated? If 99.9% of people win every match with 4 colours and only 27 people have to play, all that happens is that:

  • Brackets largely stagnate;
  • The feeling of frustration from losing a match due to poor RNG is 1,000,000 times worse because you just relegated your guild down a bracket;
  • If GW is once a month then you’ll feel even worse because it’s that much longer before you can redeem yourself. For reference, see people quitting over missing out on mythics. They want the thing now, they don’t get it, and it’s too long until the next one.

It seems to me that the issue that people take with Guild Wars is not due to its implementation but it’s nature. It’s combative. It’s a zero sum game - your win is someone else’s loss and vice versa. And it was bolted on to an easy-going casual game where people were used to winning the majority of the time, and where the greatest rewards were given to those that spent the most time, not those that played the best quality.

I like GW because it’s different to the other modes. It makes me think, and it makes me care whether I win or lose.

Additionally, there will always be a meta, and many of the suggestions to combat it are too complex to implement in 2 weeks. The code has no way of restricting team building for players except based on troop numbers. So I can’t see this changing any time soon.

These are the tweaks I would suggest:

  • Greater individual rewards to players for winning battles. I’ve said it before but the rewards and ROI compared to PvP battles are a bit of a joke. I just spent 15 minutes designing and playing a team to beat the paragon on the top guild in bracket 1! Go me! Oh, I got +41 PvP points, 3 trophies, 2-3k gold, 4 souls and 9 seals :expressionless:
  • Some flexibility to not play every day would probably help. Perhaps release 2 x 15 tickets during the week? And just count guild v guild victories over the week not the day?
  • New guild members should be able to participate. Guild tickets should work like seals - if you already used them with another guild then they’re spent, but if you haven’t then you can ‘spend’ them with your new guild.
  • Bugs regarding the number of games played should not happen. My guild played another guild that managed to register 158 battles, presumably due to server errors. Support were unable to correct this. We were all left feeling it was very unfair.
  • If the consensus is that the frequency is reduced, I would prefer it happened 3 weeks in a row with then a 1 week break.

One further point on the meta defence team issue. I agree it’s annoying to play the same team 5 x a day for GW. But the Devs have shown that they prefer simple solutions over complex ones. So if they can dream up a way to solve it through incentives or team building restrictions or whatever then great. And I’d love to discuss this with them on this forum in more detail if that’s what this thread is actually about.

Edited for typos and to add to the point about rewards for tough, time-consuming GW battles.

17 Likes
102

2 things I would like to see are:

  1. The ability to skip a battle for the cost of a gem just like PVP this will completely negate the boring repetitive double famine/kerby teams.
  2. The ability to complete all GW days on day 1 only because, like myself I am sure tons of people here have stupid busy weekends especially when the weather is nice. Yeah GW is only 5 battles everyday, but sometimes that can take a good 30 minutes, and there are days where I don’t get that 30 minutes. I’m sure I can’t be alone in having a stupid busy schedule.
2 Likes
103

If you have nothing constructive to provide please return under your bridge.

I agree with @Barbra_55 minor tweaking they can do in two weeks won’t solve the many issues GW has at the moment but it can hopefully address some of them.

As for my 2 pennies don’t make statue levels tied to the final score. It’s silly to artificially handicap newer guilds just because they joined the game later. They are already handicapped by having less resources so there is no point to punish them even if they manage to overcome those shortcomings and win. There is no reason why if two guilds get a similar score one wins just because it was created a year earlier.

4 Likes
104

Here are my suggestions and findings from reading this thread. This is coming from a mid game (Level 550) player who does his GW battles each day, probably losing 3-4 matches a week.

  • I wouldn’t mind being able to play all GW battles on any day of the week. This would allow those “weekend warriors” or those going on vacation to get their battles finished without worrying about getting on every day. To combat the daily win, how about you reward guilds on Monday reset with the amount of War wins they got. Say a weekly XP bonus of 10% per War win. You also could give the 50 seals per War win on that day too.
  • The max all sentinels to X button would be nice, though as a mid game player I would like to see a raise all sentinels by 1 button. I only ever go to level 3 each week.
  • I do support the Top 27 scores crowd. I think that allows for some weaker guild members to not stress so much when they go 1/4 each day because their 3k team score isn’t cutting it.

Lastly, I’ve seen a couple people suggesting a trickle down for sentinel bonuses for attackers. I like the idea for lower level guilds as the higher end players can boost those who aren’t high level, but what happens in brackets 1-3, where all players are fairly even in terms of team scores. With a guild made up of 30 end game players, The 18 soldiers would have higher stats than any opponent until they got to the paragon fight, where they would be even. The idea is nice, but doesn’t scale well to the top brackets.

2 Likes
105

Who exactly are you to tell me what i can and cannot do? Is me giving my opinion not “constructive” enough for you? Or would you prefer that i take the same line as many others here? Here let me “appease” you.

Ahem…

I am glad that they removed GW for two weeks! It was sooooo stressful because i had to actually put in effort and i didnt win EVERY match! That is BS! I am entitled to win everything i do every time i do it! So please when GW comes back i want it to be easier!

There is that better?

Now off to my below-bridge abode…

10 Likes
106

Taking agency away from players is not a good idea.

11 Likes
107

The Issue with guild wars can be boiled down to 5% design and 95% troop balance.

Rant:
We don’t need troop bans, troop limits, team limits, team selection limits, fixed defenses, more limits, extra colors, reduced events, reduced sentinels. Guild wars doesn’t need to be a changed to once per year or per month event, leave it weekly.

5%:
Allow all 30 to be played forward or backward play for the week (doesn’t count for Daly win)
Player count should be the same as Guild Chest: 27 players (10% vacation)
Incorporate many of the other real QoL suggestions that have been posted dozens of times in the forums.

95%:
LOCKED META. DO create a method that allows the developers to update troops VERY quickly when balance problems are discovered. This is the underlying problem that the others are swinging at blindfolded using limits/bans. On console Justice (gem spanner) has been a issue for months and months or longer.

There will be other balance issues after the current one is finally fixed. I don’t really want to wait until mid 2018 to fix the next issue, while facing it for 6-9 months.

The troop balance meta is THE underlying issue, That causes player anguish. Guild Wars just amplifiers the problem.

I hope this two week delay is not just time to rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic.

9 Likes
108

Monday is the rest day because on Monday we all have to get back to Tier 1 in PvP to earn our PvP rewards for the week.

We have to PVP to get gold to spend on Guild tasks.

We also have to spend Glory, use Glory gems, level Glory troops.

We have to read the new Event and create new teams accordingly. We have to deconstruct our Event teams from the week before.

We currently have to level our GW statues (which takes WAY too long–so terrible) and we also have to set our defenses.

So we don’t need even more stuff on a Monday. That would defeat the whole purpose of reworking GW so it’s not alienating casual gamers from playing this casual game.

6 Likes
109

This will reduce variety even more and result in a stagnant meta that is simply based on color.

Will also render previously effective anti-color troops (Desdaemona, Amira, Gnoll) completely useless.

What win percentage will satisfy people? 95% win rate is not enough?

6 Likes
110

I’m against any such limitations. Instead of forbidding something I think it’s better to encourage something different.

Hm… I don’t really understand how that can encourage diversity in defenses. Maybe if you got a reward for each troop only once? Like if all of your defense teams are Psion/Famine/Death/Famine you get 3 of such rewards. If all of your teams are a mix of the above and Deathknight hero/Famine/Death/Famine, you get four such rewards (one for Psion, one for Deathknight, one for Famine, one for Death). If ALL six of your teams use ALL unique units you get 4x6=24 rewards.
Providing all of your teams won at least once.

1 Like
111

@Saltypatra or @Ozball Please sticky this post to get the level of awareness as wide spread as possible and to get as much feedback as possible from all players. Thanks!

2 Likes
112

Oh noes, the GWs are a pain for a lot of people as they are right now. And that would just complicate things even further and put even more pressure on the players. :frowning:

113

I don’t think you understand my suggestion. You assign a pot of rewards to each troop. Say, 1000 glory. Each time you win a GW defense battle with that troop, you get one share of the pot. At the end of the week you divide that pot amongst all the winners. So if you use a troop everyone else does you get 1 glory. If you use a troop no one else did you get all 1000 glory.

It gives you a strong incentive to field teams using units no one else does. If the devs can bring themselves to do it, it would be even better to have a similar bonus for entire teams, but that would be much harder to track.

114

I don’t agree that it’s a loophole. It’s part of the strategy and it’s something that allows me to not beat myself over losing a single unit because of how much pressure GW put on ppl to win.

Please, no more restrictions!

Uhm, but that will take a lot more time! You’ll have to build 6 teams each week instead of just picking you defense team for each color from the teams that you had build previously.

I agree. True rng for the win!

The less often GWs happen the more pressure it is to win. Please, no!

I agree :slight_smile:

Yes!

Hell yes!!

115

I understand what you mean now.
The potential problem with it tho is that there are SO many players that the only troops that can give you the whole pot would be the MOST useless one that will never win.
If the troop is remotely useful a lot of people will use it and in the end you will get 1 glory for famine and 1 glory for, say, dwarf miner, because it has been divided so many time times.

1 Like
116

Whoa that’s a lot of text…

GW accentuates what’s bad about PvP: the lack of variety and extent of griefing defences. Tackling these in regular PvP is do-able but tedious. Tackling these without the full list of troops to refer to becomes stressful and extra tedious, and RNG-triggered losses really hurt.

I feel that any solution should:

  • reward participation by the whole guild on a timely basis
  • incentivise changing defence troops, or have the devs set them
  • have more imaginative ways of landing bonus points

Much of this could be moderated if there were more troops in the game, so we had more colour options, and in particular if way more troops were buffed to be viable.

Finding a better balance in the RNG drops and cascades, as well as getting gemspammers to a tolerable use-able level, would also help. Rage from the RNG spike when the enemy team fills in one cascade is greatly worsened when that sudden and ‘unfair’ loss costs you most of your day’s points. Rolling this back to roughly mimic the Adobe RNG would help.

EDIT: the suggested incoming changes to grant some immunities to mana drain will also help - both to increase the chance of beating Psion/Famine and hopefully reduce its incidence. Though it’ll just get replaced with a different meta, probably KGSFGK for now.

Note I am looking at this from a PC/mobile perspective. No one wants to see the console situation where Justice can RNG loop you to death irrespective of your team comp or skill.

9 Likes
117

Small two cents: Make doing well in a tier have it’s own rewards. The current method only rewards tier placement in 7 tiers total (tier 1 obviously, then tier 2, tier 4, tier 9, tier 19, tier 39, tier 99). Every other placement in tiers not listed receive the same value reward.

1 Like
118

I don’t have time to read the 100+ posts above, just want to add the one thing I would like to see:

Count only the best 25-27 scores for the weekly ranking. This would give a little breathing room. Guild members could go on vacation, one or two guild members who don’t like GW could sit them out without feeling bad and guilds would not have to scramble to fill any vacancies on Mondays.

Alternatively, give a way for players to opt out of GW. Use average player score for ranking, every player would have to opt-in or opt-out of GW and only participating players would receive daily/weekly rewards.

4 Likes
119

Here’s an interesting thing I just came up with. Could help add a few more rewards to the week.

When you win a certain daily War, your guild receives 5 XP (or some other number) toward that color guild statue. Would be a cool idea and allow for some extra ways to earn guild statue XP.

6 Likes
120

TL;DR
So I’ll just post my opinion without being influenced by others idea wich is fine I guess.

1/ Sentinel bonus should be reversed on offense.

The sentinel bonus should be exactly like it is for defense. For offense though, it should be reversed : Paragon should give bonus to everyone and soldiers should get all the bonuses, with higher “splash bonus” from higher rank (not a flat number like it currently is). This would be good for 3 reasons :

  • This would allow different players to becomre Paragon : other players are more likely to take the Paragon’s place since they have better bonuses, making the whole ranking thing within the guild more dynamic.
  • This would allow high end player to help lower level players get decent score in war by boosting their stats, making all members somewhat even and thus making it more fun on players with more difficulties, and more challenging on better players.
  • This would encourage high end player to spend more on bonuses instead of asking poorer, low level players to do so, wich seems healthier, and more likely to have a positive impact on game economy from a dev’s perspective.

2/ Rewards should be revisited.

Honestly, very few people play the (currently) rewarded cards. They are only scary when the ennemy lines up 4 times the same card with the 3rd trait active, and still, not so strong in my opinion. Just scary.
But not only should the reward be different, but it should be handed in a different way, read “you should get more based on your bracket AND your position in the bracket AND your position within your guild”.

Only then will all players at least strive to do better in guild wars. Currently, most of my guildmate are doing poorly and most likely don’t intend to do better. I don’t blame them as I don’t care for the rewards, I only force them to play all battles… Wich they don’t like.

I shouldn’t have to force my guildmates to do guild wars. They should want to do it for themselves, the same way they spend gold in tasks by themselves or collect Guild Seals by themselves, because it benefits them before it benefits the guild.

An exemple of reward?
Let’s say you earn your war points. At 100K war points, you can trade your points for a key wich has 100% chance to give you a random Legendary or Mythic troop.

3/ Event bonus
I fully understand the point of event bonus. Promote diversity and all this stuff wich is great. But then again, in war, you can’t always benefit from this bonus, only your defense can, yours, and ennemies defense.
Playing against boosted ennemies when you can’t answer with a line up countering nor with boosts on par can be a little frustrating.

To ensure diversity, maybe you should consider awarding points based on defense results, and these could be boosted depending on the type of units you line up.

Warning though : you should differenciate atk and def points, even more so if you include my suggestion #1, because the Paragon is the member who will most likely score the most in defense, as there should be more people attacking him.

That’s about it for me. I think this would be enough to make people want to (play / spend on / strive for better results in) war.

7 Likes