# The real reason Casual PvP's gold was nerfed
**URL:** https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033
**Category:** Gameplay Chat (PC/Mobile)
**Created:** [December 14, 2019, 8:49am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033 "2019-12-14T08:49:34Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 8:49am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/1 "2019-12-14T08:49:34Z")
Class Trials are by far the worst event in the game. The rewards don’t scale between 1 and 3 day events. Your choice for troops is the most limited of any of the restrictive modes. And it’s the same 5 matches over and over again.
So why the lack of participation in them?
All the reasons I listed above? Of course not. 😀
CASUAL PVP is the reason for lack of participation. (At least according to what I think the devs are trying to sell.)
They can’t reduce Class hero XP in casual PvP without doing it in Ranked PvP as well. Or at least it would require a lot of coding. So instead, they decided to hopefully reduce the class xp farming by making you earn less gold in cPvP.
Any person with enough experience in both PVP modes can tell you that the gold you could farm was equal.
But with class XP, you could easily earn double the xp in casual that you could in ranked.
So basically the “Exploit” was how fast we could farm hero xp (and still can mind you, just with less gold earned) that’s why the devs are staying as quiet as they can, and are not going into details about the matter.
We can all agree that Exploiting the game is a bad thing. So if the devs say “they fixed an Exploit” most will automatically be in favor of it. Compared to “hey we don’t like how folks are Farming casual PvP for hero xp, so we’re going to make it less lucrative overall by reducing gold earned by 50% (originally 66%).”
Now given my experience with Salty. If she decides to comment on this thread I’m sure she will just try to dismiss this as a “conspiracy theory”. Maybe she’s right.
But what I do know for sure is…
Both the “casual PvP Exploit” and “Illuminati” are subjects they like to throw out there…with zero proof that either one actually exist. 🤷♂️
TL:DR - It’s not a conspiracy theory to assume changes were made to slow down class XP Farming. It’s deductive reasoning due to the absence of any justifications from the devs.
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### Author:  [@Doll](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Doll)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 9:30am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/2 "2019-12-14T09:30:56Z")
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### Author:  [@ChunkyMono](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/ChunkyMono)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 9:41am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/3 "2019-12-14T09:41:36Z")
I really wish that someone on the dev team will come out and explain what the exploit is/was, and how exactly this game is “intended to be played”. I recall when the new explore mode first came out, I failed 2 mini boss fights and 3 boss fights because I was fighting for 3+hours on Warlord IV difficulty.
> [@Don't Fight Explore battles on Warlord IV](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dont-fight-explore-battles-on-warlord-iv/58606):
>
> Don’t be like me and fight 3+ hours on the wrong difficulty. Go to Casual PvP and set difficulty to normal; then go to Explore and set the desired difficulty there. Thanks to all in the latest update thread who pointed this out. I was slow to catch on.
To make matters more frustrating, some Players _and_ Devs knew about it but were neither acknowledging it nor reporting it as a bug because it could be exploited.
> [@New explore system really needs some changes!](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/new-explore-system-really-needs-some-changes/58581/11):
>
> No, we’ve been deliberately NOT filing that bug report, because it has significant benefits in another aspect of the game. I recommend not talking about it explicitly on public forums, except in terms of returning Explore to its intended level of challenge.
If the Devs would just say “we are aware this is exploitable” and then describe the exploit, we would know what we are not supposed to do.
Like in my mind, I assume they intend for us to not play as an Orc Hero. They haven’t had one in the game, and when it is finally due out on Feb 7, initial responses from top players are less than inspirational.
> [@(!) Spoiler Alert (!) -- \[Any Details Provided are Subject to Change\] (Part 1)](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/spoiler-alert-any-details-provided-are-subject-to-change-part-1/1280/8679):
>
> wow… the orc class might be the worst class in the game
That is fine. I will still use it. Others can use their Elf, Fey, and Blue Mana using classes to complete the class event. If the developers want to ban me for not “playing the game as intended”, so be it. It’s my nature.
As for other phases of the game, I’ve found that often times the best Banner to use with a faction delve team is _not_ that faction’s Banner. I hope this is not considered an exploit as well, as I might be banned before ever unlocking the Orc Hero class.
TL;DR - Devs, please tell us what is considered an exploit, and tell us we’ll be banned if we use it. I have an overactive imagination.
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### Author:  [@Goodly](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Goodly)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 9:57am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/4 "2019-12-14T09:57:25Z")
Is the removal of refresh on cPvP intentional or is my game just glitching?
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### Author:  [@anon88626343](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/anon88626343)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 9:59am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/5 "2019-12-14T09:59:30Z")
Thinking about the whole issue and the last months in general, it boils down to one thing in my mind: Literally everything that is done in and to the game is about its economics and not about the fun it should provide.
I would happily agree to a 10-20 % gold nerf on everything, if I could get rid of the excessive clicking in Explore, the useless PVP screens, delve chest animations. It slows the game, it is not fun, but it balances economics by reducing farming speed.
I really hope that in the future the first question on every change is: Is this fun to play for as many player types as possible? Second question: How can we balance the economics? And as a bonus: How can we communicate about it and implement it without breaking anything else. 😉
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### Author:  [@anon88626343](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/anon88626343)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 10:07am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/6 "2019-12-14T10:07:27Z")
Might be glitching, alright for me.
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### Author:  [@slunkwolf](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/slunkwolf)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 10:58am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/7 "2019-12-14T10:58:06Z")
The thing I dont understand is this. We are getting a new class every month. Sure they are running out of kingdoms that need class but I know that there were talks of “possibly” (meaning for sure) going past level 100 in some way. More than half of the classes are completely useless so we have to come up with teams that are not too much frustrating to use to level them up. It has been ages since I’ve used a true fast team in pvp because I have the classes of those teams already at 100. Was it really that much of a problem if people could farm around 3 xp a minute with cpvp devs? We would not do that if every class would have a purpose you know
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### Author:  [@Macawi](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Macawi)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 11:21am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/8 "2019-12-14T11:21:04Z")
They’re calling it an “exploit”, but I’m calling it what it truly is, and that’s a two and a half year-old _design flaw_ that didn’t become a thing until they decided to tighten down the screws with the amount of gold that people could make.
I can accept many things, but to insinuate that players are to blame for something that they’ve let go for this long on a game, and one by their own design, isn’t one of them.
Before pointing a finger of blame it’s always wise to look into a mirror and see if some of the onus falls upon yourself.
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### Author:  [@Fourdottwoone](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Fourdottwoone)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 12:19pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/9 "2019-12-14T12:19:17Z")
> [@Macawi](#):
>
> I can accept many things, but to insinuate that players are to blame for something that they’ve let go for this long on a game, and one by their own design, isn’t one of them.
I especially liked this official response we got when we initially discovered the nerf:
> [@4.7 Update (Patch Notes)](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/4-7-update-patch-notes/59896/100):
>
> We gave you something nice, it was exploited and abused, we took it away.
It’s really a masterpiece. It’s all **our** fault. They gave us everything we could ever wish for, and we all abused that generosity in so many despicable ways they must never be mentioned in detail. As much as it personally pains them, we just had to be collectively punished. We should be praising them for not taking away more than they ever gave.
If one tried to express utter disdain towards the whole community, I doubt one could find any better way to formulate it.
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### Author:  [@Slypenslyde](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Slypenslyde)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 2:43pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/10 "2019-12-14T14:43:29Z")
They’ve never been good at admitting mistakes. If they leave in a resource bug, it was “something nice” they “did on purpose”. If they screw up a resource, “We’re looking into how this happened”, i.e. “It can’t have been US.” It’s always the publisher. Or the platform holder. Never the people who write the code that defines the game’s behavior.
It reminds me of a character in _Eureeka’s Castle_ on Nick Jr. Batly the Bat was a little clumsy, and rarely nailed his landings. Usually he’d arrive, cause some chaos, then say his catchphrase, “I _meant_ to do that.”
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### Author:  [@Arelana](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Arelana)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 4:27pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/11 "2019-12-14T16:27:53Z")
> [@Fourdottwoone](#):
>
> We should be praising them for not taking away more than they ever gave.
Honestly, it’s this level of straight-up **arrogance** that has me more upset than the nerf itself.
If there was a legitimate exploit and it was allowed to continue for _years_, that’s on the devs, not on the players. A cheating player is a cheating player, but failure to cut off the cheat in a timely manner, to the point where it’s possible the behavior could have been considered to be condoned or normalized _specifically because of the lack of action_ falls **squarely** on the devs.
I understand that they’re frustrated. We don’t know the entire story. It’s entirely possible that 505 called them to the carpet about not fixing this sooner and forced them to prioritize it, throwing their entire development cycle into the trash, or obligating the team to work a ton of overtime because of deadlines, or what say you. That kind of thing pisses people off and frustrates them.
That doesn’t make any less unprofessional to take it out on their **customers**.
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### Author:  [@GIBERTONI](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/GIBERTONI)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 6:24pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/12 "2019-12-14T18:24:04Z")
I remember when they fixed the “exploit” on casual pvp after setting explorer to Warlord IV
right after Explorer update…that was fast…
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### Author:  [@Tabu](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Tabu)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 7:46pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/13 "2019-12-14T19:46:26Z")
I think the op is right, but I think that is only part of why they changed gold in pvp.
The entire point of 4.7 was to essentially eliminate LTs. By adding epic tasks they accomplished this for 95% of players. Other people have done the math to prove that.
What they then did is severely limit LTs for the other 4% by squashing gold drops in pvp.
This eliminates LTs for 99% of players. The 1% are people who basically have all the things anyhow. For them Mythics from LTs aren’t really important. Neither are keys and traitstones. Unless new troops come out, which they have stockpiles of mats to use for them. So the people who don’t really need them have access while those who do have limited or no access.
I would like for once a company with paying customers to stop being cowards and tell us like it is. I’m sick of the nonsense and not only from these devs, but any company for any product.
Well thats my two cents.
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### Author:  [@Hoots711](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Hoots711)
#### Post date: [December 14, 2019, 8:33pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/14 "2019-12-14T20:33:15Z")
This is in no way saying that the shenanigans about fixing this “exploit” are acceptable but why would devs really care how fast people level their classes? Some are totally worthless and most are not worth leveling past 40. Active players have the 4 or 5 classes they use at 100. The rest is mostly completionist.
This whole issue seems to be less evil genious and more useful idiot imho.
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [December 15, 2019, 12:48am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/15 "2019-12-15T00:48:39Z")
> [@Hoots711](#):
>
> This is in no way saying that the shenanigans about fixing this “exploit” are acceptable but why would devs really care how fast people level their classes?
As cited in the OP. Class Trials are underperforming. They want us to use more gems for class XP…
Anytime players aren’t playing any part of the game… It’s a bad thing for the devs.
Their hope is, less activity in cPvP will translate to more activity in class trials.
But essentially this all theory due to the lack of any facts presented from the devs. Other than “they fixed an Exploit” that didn’t exist… Unless of course “Farming hero XP easily” is considered an “Exploit”.
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### Author:  [@Saltypatra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Saltypatra)
#### Post date: [December 15, 2019, 5:59am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/16 "2019-12-15T05:59:11Z")
I’ve posted a further clarification [on the issue here.](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/pvp-gold-exploit-and-fix-clarification-further-info-inside/60046)
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [December 15, 2019, 6:59am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/17 "2019-12-15T06:59:07Z")
My thoughts. 😀
> [@PVP Gold Exploit and Fix Clarification (Further Info Inside)](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/pvp-gold-exploit-and-fix-clarification-further-info-inside/60046/8):
>
> My defenses wins 2:1 of the time so evidently a hard defense. I still got easy opponents. I win one ranked battle, but it wouldn’t matter if I did or not. I do it out of curiosity to see how much the AI is favoring my defense or not. I would still get easy opponents in cPvP. Because they are casual players. The only way their defenses could enter the PvP pool is to do a ranked match. That’s by your design and now accusing folks of exploiting the game by broadening your PvP match making. N…
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### Author:  [@Slypenslyde](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Slypenslyde)
#### Post date: [December 15, 2019, 4:16pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/18 "2019-12-15T16:16:49Z")
> [@Hoots711](#):
>
> but why would devs really care how fast people level their classes?
Supposedly Class Trials are supposed to be a way to spend gems to get class XP.
The problem is the bonus XP is pretty trivial compared to just doing PvP battles for the same amount of time/effort. I really think they should add a ton of bonus XP, or make the reward for certain prize tiers be “you gain a level unconditionally”. All said and done the effort/reward ratio for class trials completely turns me off.
Making other modes worse doesn’t change that. I’m never going to get excited about being asked to do $50 of labor to make $1.
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### Author:  [@slunkwolf](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/slunkwolf)
#### Post date: [December 20, 2019, 9:47pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/19 "2019-12-20T21:47:22Z")
because sooner or later you will need those awful classes to be 100 for kingdom leveling. And trust me if you completely ignore it for multiple kingdoms (almost all of them since as you said the true good classes are like 5) you will miss out on ton of rewards from tribute. It’s the same sh- I mean stuff from delves. Now you simply cannot ignore the 2500 points on every faction because you need the pet to level up the kingdom. Either that or you wait for the second normal pet, which, by the looks on spoilers on what the next few pets are gonna be, it’s going to happen in 2030
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### Author:  [@thelastdragon](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/thelastdragon)
#### Post date: [December 20, 2019, 9:56pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-real-reason-casual-pvps-gold-was-nerfed/60033/20 "2019-12-20T21:56:17Z")
what I don’t get is if the exploit was fixed and no longer exploitable why can’t they tell us what it was it’s fixed so trying to do it now wouldn’t yield any results
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