# The Phoenicia Dilemma **URL:** \ **Category:** Gameplay Chat (PC/Mobile)\ **Created:** [January 6, 2022, 10:01pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-phoenicia-dilemma/73667 "2022-01-06T22:01:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 1\ **Showing post:** 23
**Author:** ![xolid99](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/xolid99/32/66856_2.png) [@xolid99](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/xolid99)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2022, 5:56pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-phoenicia-dilemma/73667/23 "2022-01-13T17:56:35Z")
> [@igniteice](#): > > > [@dank-o](#): > > > > Edit: I understand @igniteice’s idea, he’s looking for ways to do it in the fewest & fastest reliable moves possible. > > Exactly – when vault weekend is over and you have 200 vault keys… that’s a lot of vault runs. Very True I was wondering though, the challenging vault offers 10% less rewards. So I gave it a few spins. The stats are much lower, most have about 45 life at challenging vs 84 vs hard. 1 shot with any Phoenicia team - even souls teams with Veno can 1 shot. So, logically you can make up any shortfall in souls by running say; Phylactery, Venoxia, Leprechaun, Pharos Ra and be faster than a hard vault. You can run; insert hero and blue/brown weapon, Phoenicia, Leprechaun, TMQ and 1 shot Rewards (From memory) 120 Souls 600 Souls 3000 Souls 1 Event Key 4 Event keys 18 Event Keys 6 Gems 24 Gems 120 Gems 300 Gems 3,000 gold 4,800 gold 7,200 gold 24,000 gold 36,000 gold 60,000 gold 72,000 gold 1 Gem Key 5 Gem Keys 24 Gem Keys 2 Diamonds 6 Diamonds 60 Diamonds So I noticed the following; 6 Gems still is 6 Gems, as is 2 of anything or 6 of anything (it seems). I got 110 Gems instead of 120 Gems I got 110 Souls instead of 120 Souls I got 4400 Gold instead of 4800 Gold I got 2750 Gold instead of 3000 Gold I got 5500 Gold instead of 6000 Gold I got 17 Event Keys instead of 18 I got 3 Event Keys instead of 4. I got 22 Gem Keys instead of 24 Gem Keys, but got 1 and 5 Gem Keys vs 1 and 5 Gem keys. I got the same Heart of Rage, The Star, The Moon and Baz Boneater. So, for an end-gamer, _unless the orb or tarot/band member drop rate is less_, then do we really need to do a 120% vault if we are just worried about speed? Sure, 500 vault keys, if you got 2 million gold and 1500 gems, you would end up with 1.8 million gold and 1350 gems (as the 6 gems is not reduced, you may end up with say 1400), but you would be earning that gold sooner elsewhere. I looked through 309 vaults I did for testing when we were testing the drop rates. I changed that to 250 and I got 24 gem keys 10 times, so would lose 20 Gem Keys, or 40 Gem Keys for 500 VK going by that rate (which is obviously not going to be a given every time, but it’s a workable number). I lost about 15 Event Keys, so 30 Event Keys. I lost about 36 Diamonds, so 72 Diamonds. I got 120 gems 4 times and 300 2 times. A loss of 10 x 4 + 30 x 2 - 100 Gems, which could be 200 Gems, so that is something. According to this thread, there is no difference in relation to obtaining major orbs. > [@5.1 Update](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/5-1-update/65392): > > 5.1 UPDATE Kingdoms will now be able to be leveled to 20 In addition to the normal Gold and Imperial Deeds, Kingdom Levels 16-20 will also need a new type of Deed, the Book of Deeds. (See below for more details) The rewards for levelling up your Kingdom will include (not necessarily in this order): Bonus Mythstones from that Kingdom’s Explore More Faction Hoard Stats Kingdom Team Bonus to Tier V Kingdom Skill Point Books of Deeds have 6 variations… So, over 500 keys, the main loss is about .5 of a gem per vault key used it seems (obviously could be crunched more but all the numbers are in a s/s) vs finishing them much faster. The gold can be recouped, souls can be greater at a similar speed. There is a loss of some event keys, gem keys and diamonds. I’m only really interested in orbs, so 40 gem or event keys per 500 VK is no loss really. I suppose the gem loss is something however. Could you make that up? No. So that’s probably the trade-off. Would I do challenging vs hard, if I’m not time conscious, no. If I am time conscious, might do. I might mix them if I had too many keys. --- _[View the full topic](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/the-phoenicia-dilemma/73667)._