# Still time to change the new Mythic **URL:** \ **Category:** Uncategorized\ **Created:** [June 4, 2019, 10:55pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531 "2019-06-04T22:55:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Demigod](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/demigod/32/50693_2.png) [@Demigod](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Demigod)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2019, 10:55pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/1 "2019-06-04T22:55:23Z")
Before its released this Friday. We all know this gonna be The weakest on the list. And that kingdom already have one. Why make it 2. Think about before releasing it. Think about the garbage think about the environment. U destroying the world lol Just kidding But I hope u guys change your minds about this mythic. Just my opinion ---
**Author:** ![Mithran](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/mithran/32/18064_2.png) [@Mithran](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Mithran)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2019, 11:41pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/2 "2019-06-04T23:41:04Z")
Gargantaur might still be weaker. Really sucks to have two bottom tier mythics in the same kingdom, though, particularly where they are outclassed by so many of the lower rarity options in the same kingdom, which are in and of themselves not even _that_ good. Relevant idea on how to buff him: > [@(!) Spoiler Alert (!) -- \[Any Details Provided are Subject to Change\] (Part 1)](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/spoiler-alert-any-details-provided-are-subject-to-change/1280/8056): > > Lethal requirement to get summons is a mechanic that is generally too narrow to be a viable part of any strategy. Also, since his boost ratio is based on static elements, hitting that lethal damage mark will get harder and harder. Hes another mythic that will always drop the turn and the traits nonsensically conflict with each other. One good point about him is he has completely zero conflict with both the thing he summons and the legendary that boosts him to 50% start and is fed by one of … Doubt anything will change this close to release, though. And after release, even if it does get buffed, we are more than likely going to see a pure numbers buff than any significant redesign, unfortunately. ---
**Author:** ![XLS78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/b2d939/32.png) [@XLS78](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/XLS78)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 12:12am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/3 "2019-06-05T00:12:39Z")
Maybe the logic is that two bad mythics from the same kingdom are collectively equal to one good one? 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![Kafka](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/kafka/32/33529_2.png) [@Kafka](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Kafka)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 12:28am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/4 "2019-06-05T00:28:27Z")
He’s actually quite strong on a skull generator team especially after he starts summoning Fist of Zorn 😬 If I find him I’ll be putting him at the front of my team, kill an enemy, have a troop like Fist of Zorn start with full mana, convert all yellow to skulls and give Shade of Zorn more attack power, gain mana when he takes skull damage, cast, kill, generate skulls, get an extra turn through board control, try to fill Shade through doom skull explosions, cast, kill. Looking forward to coming up with a nice team for him. Probably won’t replace my favourite Yao Guai team but is still fun. ---
**Author:** ![Eika](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/eika/32/103088_2.png) [@Eika](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Eika)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 12:33am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/5 "2019-06-05T00:33:14Z")
> [@Mithran](#): > > Doubt anything will change this close to release, though. And after release, even if it does get buffed, we are more than likely going to see a pure numbers buff than any significant redesign, unfortunately. Spot on, close to zero effort is put into rebalancing or buffing troops - so we can’t expect it. It’s almost as it does’nt exist anymore. That they do not manage to make a useful mythic troop 12 times a year is totally unbelievable. It’s really the bare minimum to ask for. ---
**Author:** ![Hanom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e47c2d/32.png) [@Hanom](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Hanom)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 1:00am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/6 "2019-06-05T01:00:45Z")
Will the summoned fist of zorn be full of mana? That might be ok. ---
**Author:** ![awryan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/awryan/32/74650_2.png) [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 1:12am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/7 "2019-06-05T01:12:58Z")
> [@Kafka](#): > > If I find him I’ll be putting him at the front of my team, kill an enemy, have a troop like Fist of Zorn start with full mana, Since when do Empowered troops who are summoned start with full Mana? If that’s the case then yeah he’s good. If they are summoned like any other Empowered troop then he’s garbage. The troops will be nothing more than a meat shield. And why use him as a pure summoner when there’s a legendary troop that gives half Mana to orcs, spawns gems, and summons a better variety than 2 troops of the exact same type who are Transformers. ---
**Author:** ![Griswald](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/griswald/32/27385_2.png) [@Griswald](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Griswald)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 1:36am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/8 "2019-06-05T01:36:05Z")
That’s a good point- two of the same transformers is pretty much a waste. ---
**Author:** ![XLS78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/b2d939/32.png) [@XLS78](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/XLS78)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 1:52am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/9 "2019-06-05T01:52:52Z")
It is clearly _possible_ to summon an Empowered troop (The Dragon Soul can), but this was definitely _not_ what happened with summoned Fists on Salty’s preview stream. They had zero mana to start and were thus nearly useless. ---
**Author:** ![Saltypatra](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/saltypatra/32/59750_2.png) [@Saltypatra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Saltypatra)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 1:54am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/10 "2019-06-05T01:54:33Z")
To be fair, there were some bugs associated with my stream. ---
**Author:** ![XLS78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/b2d939/32.png) [@XLS78](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/XLS78)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 1:58am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/11 "2019-06-05T01:58:22Z")
That’s totally fair and understandable. So do the summoned Fists in fact appear with full mana? ---
**Author:** ![Crow](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/crow/32/44074_2.png) [@Crow](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Crow)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 1:59am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/12 "2019-06-05T01:59:21Z")
Time for science, and try summon Gimlet with King ironforge and see if he is empowered. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/jonathan/32/66724_2.png) [@Jonathan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Jonathan)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 2:16am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/13 "2019-06-05T02:16:11Z")
When summoned troops start with full mana, it clearly states this on the card: ![gemsofwar](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/uploads/gemsofwar/original/3X/7/d/7d30da35d2a1dcb88c21f1b0825f8b48b609429e.jpeg) ![IMG_20190605_120902](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/uploads/gemsofwar/original/3X/2/3/231950c610517e5636a54216b3d0d5a6a5bb5637.jpeg) Obviously Shade of Zorn hasn’t been released yet and could be subject to change, but given the absence of such text in its spoiler data and its behaviour on stream, it seems unlikely they would have full mana when summoned (these traits trigger at the start of battle only, iirc/afaik). ^ Also a note for the consistency team re: ‘Empowered’/‘with full mana’. ---
**Author:** ![Crow](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/crow/32/44074_2.png) [@Crow](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Crow)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 2:19am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/14 "2019-06-05T02:19:04Z")
I tried and got Gem hammer and Gimlet, with zero mana ---
**Author:** ![noob](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/noob/32/54823_2.png) [@noob](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/noob)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 2:37am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/15 "2019-06-05T02:37:24Z")
Same with spiritdancer/spirit fox ---
**Author:** ![Kafka](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/kafka/32/33529_2.png) [@Kafka](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Kafka)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 3:36am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/16 "2019-06-05T03:36:06Z")
Err I didn’t say that Fist of Zorn would have full mana on summon, I said “have a troop like Fist of Zorn start with full mana” As in, I’ll be putting Fist of Zorn on the team. ---
**Author:** ![PeperandSalt](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/peperandsalt/32/54110_2.png) [@PeperandSalt](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/PeperandSalt)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 4:46am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/17 "2019-06-05T04:46:57Z")
Then that’s disappointing 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![Shimrra](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/shimrra/32/87_2.png) [@Shimrra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Shimrra)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 5:28am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/18 "2019-06-05T05:28:31Z")
Flimsy damage with the unlikely conditional reward being up to two summons who don’t do the ONLY thing they’re good at doing (empower → fast start) AND interfere with each other (using same mana + board conditions). And of course the usual summon problem ensues as well, this being the one where if we’re in control enough to get kills (especially with something as tactically inoffensive as this) then we shouldn’t be losing troops in the first place. So its reserved for being down on one’s luck but not totally screwed, or gimmicky nonsense. Hard pass, collecting one for when it gets buffed. ---
**Author:** ![KYLENATOR001](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/kylenator001/32/33983_2.png) [@KYLENATOR001](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/KYLENATOR001)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 5:51am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/19 "2019-06-05T05:51:26Z")
@Kafka, My problem with this mythic is short of there being massive ninja buffs to shade, the devs are overvaluing his usefullness. Much like Phoenicia, it is a troop that does not work with its kingdom or typing and is almost counter intuitive. As an example, Phoenicia, while having the potential to do high damage, can only do so with Infernus and/or the sunspear hero, who have way better support options. The traits are weak and the spell can do high damage, but nothing so stellar it is a must have and is so bad for her own kingdom that at least fallen valdis does something better in both kingdom synergy and usefulness in general. As @Shimrra said, the summons are useless for the mythic. On top of that, the spell damage is low with a damage cap that would prevent OHKOs. The base damage can barely exceed 30 with all relevant buffs and the boost sounds nice, except the ally portion is bad as Queen Titania also gets the same boost of 4x per ally AND enemy in an AOE that if there are plenty of red gems, she may not do more damage, but does get an extra turn. The red gem bonus is generally bad as most troops with good boosts tend to remove or destroy the gems for the boost. Leaving them there is risky if one is attempting to get any damage. Now let’s hit the skull aspect shall we? A troop with zero skull damage prevention, barrier, and not even orc armor? The mythic trait is so bad, I legitimately think you guys have lost all creativity in balance. Aside from the tentacle elephant in the room, Psion, 4 mana is nothing. By the time he would fill up, he’d be dead, well, again. Let’s not forget war, the mythic tank who used to be quite the terror (Give us back pyromania for infernal armor). Aside from war, we have numerous lower rarity troops like crimson arrow, who has agile ad well as eagle eye. You made a troop that fills zero roles and would be laughable as a legendary with a 14 mana spell. Xathenos does what this guy does, but better. He steals life, magic, buffs his troop type, and can summon USEFUL troops. Instead of giving some buffs to legendaries or mythics who need it, you make essentially a spiritual successor that is even worse. I don’t understand how you can make a legendary that does so much that is useable despite the jumbled synergy, and a mythic that is such a bad orc, I am convinced the reason Grosh-Nak doesn’t have a hero class is out of pure shame. TLDR: We don’t move Gargantuar from the bottom of uesless mythics, by displacing him with another bad orc one. ---
**Author:** ![XLS78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/b2d939/32.png) [@XLS78](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/XLS78)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2019, 10:46am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531/20 "2019-06-05T10:46:48Z")
Not to beat a dead Orc here, but even Tian Yi, while not anywhere near a top tier mythic, is better than Shade in basically every way (traits, probable damage output, summons). [Next page](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/still-time-to-change-the-new-mythic/55531.md?page=2)