# Raid boss level and damage dealt
**URL:** https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453
**Category:** Gameplay Chat (PC/Mobile)
**Created:** [March 24, 2018, 2:34pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453 "2018-03-24T14:34:00Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@netwizard](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/netwizard)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 2:34pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/1 "2018-03-24T14:34:00Z")
How do some people manage to be on lower boss levels and still do tremendous amounts of damage? 1st place guy has only 365lvl, but still greatly outpaces the third place. I know he probably bought a lot of sigils and lost many fights while still dealing damage to the boss, however~ Maybe there is some detail I don’t know? Maybe there is something I can do to improve my score, too?
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### Author:  [@Shimrra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Shimrra)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 3:32pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/2 "2018-03-24T15:32:39Z")
As I said the _last_ time this was asked (sorry :P):
You can do a ton of damage - even kill off Zuul completely - and still lose the fight. This means your “boss level” does not advance.
It just takes a lot more sigils.
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### Author:  [@negatus](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/negatus)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 3:39pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/3 "2018-03-24T15:39:44Z")
P2W is also a factor. Buy more matches (points) with gems.
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### Author:  [@Mithran](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Mithran)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 3:49pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/4 "2018-03-24T15:49:43Z")
Nope, thats about it.
- Buy Sigils.
- Kill boss asap
- end the battle asap, even if it means losing
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### Author:  [@Shimrra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Shimrra)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 3:49pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/5 "2018-03-24T15:49:58Z")
Well yes. Someone can always score higher than everyone else by throwing more gems at it, no matter how skilled they are (or aren’t). Which is why I have zero faith in _any_ of these new modes’ leaderboards.
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### Author:  [@Slypenslyde](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Slypenslyde)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 6:25pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/6 "2018-03-24T18:25:42Z")
If we could see their win/loss record, or at least “sigils spent” I think we’d find Shimrra is right.
If you make 500 points per game and lose 25% of the time, I’ll make more points than you if I get 250/game, win 100% of the time, and play more games than you.
It’s not a leaderboard. It’s a loserboard. It represents the people who think an orb of power is worth hundreds of dollars in gems.
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### Author:  [@Gouki](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Gouki)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 6:52pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/7 "2018-03-24T18:52:39Z")
> [@Slypenslyde](#):
>
> It’s not a leaderboard. It’s a loserboard. It represents the people who think an orb of power is worth hundreds of dollars in gems.
Or people who have just won so big in life that they don’t have to care about this puny amount of money, which would make it the truest of leaderboards.
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### Author:  [@Slypenslyde](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Slypenslyde)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 8:55pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/8 "2018-03-24T20:55:30Z")
Here’s the thing about that. It’s like an auction.
In an auction, everyone in the room has an idea in their head what an item’s worth. A big chunk of people undervalue it. Some people overvalue it. The only person in the room who wins is the person who overvalues it the most. From an economic standpoint, that means you can only _lose_ an auction: by definition you can only obtain the item by paying too much for it.
That’s this leaderboard. A big chunk of the game’s figured out what the various prizes are worth. These people think it’s worth more. And because they think it’s worth more, they get to compete with each other by paying even more money just to prove they think it’s worth even more than the other guy.
Now, valuation can be subjective. There are some things that hold more than monetary value. That’s one good reason to overpay in an auction.
In this case, we’re probably talking about “holding a week-long position on a leaderboard in a game a few thousand people play” vs. “buying about 3 games with 50+ hours of content”. That’s a really unhealthy valuation.
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### Author:  [@Shimrra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Shimrra)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 9:40pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/9 "2018-03-24T21:40:44Z")
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### Author:  [@Mithran](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Mithran)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2018, 9:52pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/10 "2018-03-24T21:52:07Z")
You have no idea how many times I almost posted this very GIF in the various threads discussing how much “value” you get out of your gems by buying in to high tiers.
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### Author:  [@Fleg](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Fleg)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2018, 12:09am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/11 "2018-03-25T00:09:23Z")
We should start our own leader board. With the aim of getting the LOWEST score for Boss level 100/200/300 etc.
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### Author:  [@Lyrian](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyrian)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2018, 1:00am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/12 "2018-03-25T01:00:12Z")
> [@Fleg](#):
>
> We should start our own leader board. With the aim of getting the LOWEST score for Boss level 100/200/300 etc.
The problem with that concept is that as each level for Zuul is worth a fixed maximum of points, and you need you score that many points (killing Zuul and winning the match) to move up to the next Boss level, the lowest possible score at any given Boss level (100/200/300/etc.) is literally to never lose any match up to that Boss level.
Higher scores only result from replaying levels because of losing to Zuul previously (or replaying level 500).
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### Author:  [@Fleg](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Fleg)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2018, 1:18am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/13 "2018-03-25T01:18:42Z")
Yes I know that. There will obviously be multiple players going flawless past 100/200 but the higher you go the harder flawless becomes. Very unlikely anyone would make it to 300 flawless. So then it becomes who got there with the lowest score.
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### Author:  [@Lyrian](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyrian)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2018, 1:59am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/14 "2018-03-25T01:59:54Z")
That’s fair.
It would be an interesting challenge, for sure.
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### Author:  [@TheIdleOne](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/TheIdleOne)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2018, 2:03am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/15 "2018-03-25T02:03:15Z")
longest unbeaten streak for an event week would be a neat track
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### Author:  [@netwizard](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/netwizard)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2018, 7:27am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/16 "2018-03-25T07:27:38Z")
Speaking of which, how much do you think Orb of Power is worth in gems? 100? 200?
For me, the real MVP is a small Orb of Ascension. It’s worth is at least err… 30-50 gem keys = 300-500 gems, maybe? To ascend Guild Guardians.
If I wanted to ascend a new Legendary, then I would gladly spend half price of what I’d spend without OaA. Say, estimated cost to get 5 Legendaries is 420 Event keys, then OaA is worth 210 Event keys = 3150 gems. Horrible price, but to those with “I want it right NOW” mindset the price seems reasonable.
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### Author:  [@TimeKnight](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/TimeKnight)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2018, 11:32am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/17 "2018-03-25T11:32:06Z")
I usually just want to stop buying only at Tier IV, ended up also buying V and VI this week on impulse. First because I want to celebrate lucky trait-farming streak. Second because I want that 50 diamonds.
Spending all extra sigils, I got to level 370 with 42,000+ score, placing on the second half of top 100 leaderboard. (Will check again before weekly reset) so extra 75 gems and Orbs of Chaos! Not that impressive, but pretty good for not buying Tier VII. And my aim is Diamonds so any reward is just some icing on the cake!
For leaderboard, although it’s pretty much pay-to-win, people with skill can still compete with heavy gem spender in some degree. It’s all about sigil efficiency. You can make the most of the free one you have by playing increasing challange levels, or keep playing safe easy levels at cost of extra gems/sigils.
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### Author:  [@Slypenslyde](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Slypenslyde)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2018, 2:00pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/18 "2018-03-25T14:00:33Z")
Coming up with the gem cost is really hard. If I focus on just gems, of COURSE an OoP is worth lots of cash. That’s not the only factor, though.
TL;DR:
- If I take the bait and do math I’d say a ridiculous number like “40,000 gems”.
- I think it’s smarter to say, “I’d spend every available gem if I thought it guaranteed an Orb of Power.”
- But my “every available gem” is usually not much bigger than 500.
- I think with that 500 gems/week it will take me maybe 2 months to build my own OoP out of minor orbs.
- I estimate within 2 months I won’t have any troops left “worth” spending an OoP to max.
- I estimate people are spending north of $200 to chase the leaderboard.
- 2 leaderboards could buy a Nintendo Switch and the new Smash Bros. game.
Converting gems to dollars to time is where it gets me. The OoP “saves” me months of card acquisition. So do orbs of ascension, which I can get randomly for much cheaper at a very slow rate.
All of this combines to make OoP “worthless” to me, in the sense that so long as acquisition is tied to “what it is worth” I can’t and won’t pay that price. I’d rather make a DIY OoP out of a lot of minors. THAT is within my grasp.
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### Author:  [@Taisiakat](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Taisiakat)
#### Post date: [March 26, 2018, 12:53am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/19 "2018-03-26T00:53:42Z")
What frustrates me about the entire concept is the fact we’re forced to use a kingdom - that the last two raids did not the right troops to even build a counter team that will survive.
For example - my mythic level Freya should have more Attack than the stupid Bird - Valraven hits Freya for 45 points for attack.
When none of the troops have immunity to fire - that basically creates a problem.
And when a troop can only be really useful against a boss - but barely makes a dent in any other troop, that’s waste too.
Add that to the fact that there are no seals for folks who loose but contribute boss kills.
Plus the lost in gold, gems and glory. Even explore gives me more because I build my own explore teams
I’m finding this useless
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### Author:  [@aurvandil](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/aurvandil)
#### Post date: [March 26, 2018, 1:02am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/raid-boss-level-and-damage-dealt/37453/20 "2018-03-26T01:02:54Z")
If you are looking to just kill the boss without leveling him, you can probably use a team with multiple godslayer troops e.g. Mang + Freya + Freya + Freya; Lantern banner. After you “mang” the boss, you are 100% able to kill him even if he gets his spell up since you have 3 godslayers. This might be a strategy worth looking at toward of the week when the battles are becoming too long/difficult to be fun.
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