# Potions Explosions are hurting more than helping?
**URL:** https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824
**Category:** Gameplay Chat (PC/Mobile)
**Created:** [June 18, 2019, 1:35am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824 "2019-06-18T01:35:22Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 1:35am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/1 "2019-06-18T01:35:22Z")
I’ve noticed the tremendous “coincidence” of boards that have 4 or 5 gem matches available at the start of the match being taken away thanks to Potion Explosions. I suspect “the combo” breaker is telling the RNG where to Target the explosion where it prevents extra turns. For those that don’t know…“combo breaker” is the mechanic that makes sure the AI and you don’t get too many extra turns from gem spawners. I get that Explosions aren’t spawners, but something is definitely afoot at the start of the match that triggers this “occurrence”.
I could take all the videos in the world of it. Won’t matter. You’ll either think the Explosions are working against you or you won’t.
What I hope is a dev actually takes time to look into it, and hopefully it isn’t currently working as intended.
I don’t need the admission of me being right and it being broken. Please just fix it. 😀
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### Author:  [@Shimrra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Shimrra)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 8:42am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/2 "2019-06-18T08:42:15Z")
This is too much. I have noticed it as well and y’know what? This is pure recall bias. The explosions also leave us boards that have 4-/5-matches available.
Run something that starts the game with a storm in play and everything is good.
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### Author:  [@Fourdottwoone](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Fourdottwoone)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 8:45am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/3 "2019-06-18T08:45:27Z")
It’s kind of hard to throw four explosions at the board without seriously disrupting any available extra turn matches. That’s up to 36 gems removed, plus resulting cascades to mix tings up. It would take a huge amount of luck for any extra turn match to still be available afterwards, no “combo breaker” needed.
For what it’s worth, I’m slowly getting better at grasping the whole board state prior to explosions. It’s easy to see extra turn matches getting disrupted, it’s much harder to see a horrible board getting turned into something much more favorable. As far as I can tell by now, both situations happen reasonably often enough.
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 8:47am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/4 "2019-06-18T08:47:02Z")
> [@Shimrra](#):
>
> Run something that starts the game with a storm in play and everything is good.
Exploding a board plus a storm? I’m shocked when I don’t get an extra turn from that formula.
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 8:49am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/5 "2019-06-18T08:49:09Z")
> [@Fourdottwoone](#):
>
> It’s kind of hard to throw four explosions at the board without seriously disrupting any available extra turn matches
That’s a great point. It’s just a kick in the 🌰 when you see a 4 and 5 match at the start but both are taken off the board thanks to a tier that frankly can’t be avoided.
I’d feel a lot better about it if it wasn’t 50% of the Mana being counted.
We’ll need that increased again when every match the AI does it summons troops.
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### Author:  [@Fourdottwoone](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Fourdottwoone)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 8:53am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/6 "2019-06-18T08:53:31Z")
> [@awryan](#):
>
> It’s just a kick in the 🌰 when you see a 4 and 5 match at the start but both are taken off the board thanks to a tier that frankly can’t be avoided.
Why would anyone want to avoid that tier? You are looking at it the wrong way, just ignore whatever board state you briefly see at the start, you get an entirely different board instead plus a pile of starting mana.
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 9:05am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/7 "2019-06-18T09:05:51Z")
> [@Fourdottwoone](#):
>
> Why would anyone want to avoid that tier? You are looking at it the wrong way, just ignore whatever board state you briefly see at the start, you get an entirely different board instead plus a pile of starting mana.
So today… The build I’m using in low level ToD… That 5 gem match would of given me a surge plus 3 Explosions anyway. So more Mana than the tier provided. I get that on crap builds (class trials) it can really help. But honestly, I feel like it’s slowing me down this week. 🤷♀️
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### Author:  [@Fourdottwoone](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Fourdottwoone)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 10:37am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/8 "2019-06-18T10:37:11Z")
> [@awryan](#):
>
> That 5 gem match would of given me a surge plus 3 Explosions anyway. So more Mana than the tier provided.
So you got slightly less mana once, a lot more mana all the other times? I still don’t see why that would be considered a bad deal?
The difference between playing without or with explosion potions is essentially this:
1.) Start with an entirely random board.
2.) Start with an entirely random board that can be nudged a bit in your favor, plus a random amount of mana.
Given a choice, I’d always pick option 2.
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### Author:  [@akots](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/akots)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 10:50am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/9 "2019-06-18T10:50:41Z")
The only thing that explosions actually do in terms of random is slightly increase the chance for skulls to show up and very slightly decrease the chance for non-skull tiles. On one hand, this may lower the chance of having a non-skull-related 4+ match although it might increase the chance of a 4+ match that is skull-related. Basically, it depends on specific cards. For example, chances for potential 4+ matches of Mercy may be lower after explosions. However, chances for potential 4+ matches of Apophisis may be higher. Apothisis/Fist of Zorn are not a meta and probably very few people use it in their attack teams. However, a lot of people use Mercy, Moon Rabbit, Gimlet, etc. So, technically speaking, on average, for teams that use instant converters, explosions may be somewhat of a setback. IDK how substantial the impact is. So, no, the OP is not paranoid or delusional. It is quite a fair and rational observation IMHO.
There might be three solutions. First, the player does not buy anything from the shop. Second, make the potion selection menu where players can equip/unequip potions for specific battles. Third, try not to rely too much on empowered converters. They should still work but at a somewhat reduced chance of successful 4+ matches similar like conditional converters ( color a to color b) after the board has been perturbed. Unconditional converters (any color to color a) don’t have empowered.
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 10:58am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/10 "2019-06-18T10:58:16Z")
> [@Fourdottwoone](#):
>
> 2.) Start with an entirely random board that can be nudged a bit in your favor, plus a random amount of mana.
It could just as easily work against you as well.
I’m not saying potions should be removed or that they are entirely bad. I just don’t think it’s as cut and dry as most assume it to be. I personally, this week, would like the option to turn them off for ToD. Next Invasions or raids they could be a god send. This week, for me, I think they are punching me in the face, and when I’m like WTF?!?! They’re like you had a spider on your face, I killed it, you’re welcome.
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### Author:  [@Fourdottwoone](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Fourdottwoone)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 11:14am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/11 "2019-06-18T11:14:14Z")
> [@awryan](#):
>
> It could just as easily work against you as well.
Not really, it’s very heavily weighted in your favor. Consider it like rolling a die, 1 gets you a slightly worse deal, 2 to 6 gets you a significantly better deal.
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### Author:  [@Amadan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Amadan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 11:26am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/12 "2019-06-18T11:26:52Z")
> [@awryan](#):
>
> “combo breaker” is the mechanic that makes sure the AI ~~and you~~ don’t get too many extra turns from gem spawners **but lucky for us, it doesn’t apply to the player’s turn**
So, uh…that was easy, I guess.
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 11:38am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/13 "2019-06-18T11:38:20Z")
> [@Amadan](#):
>
> So, uh…that was easy, I guess.
Combo breaker doesn’t apply to the players turn?
Say whut now?!?
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 11:39am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/14 "2019-06-18T11:39:27Z")
> [@Fourdottwoone](#):
>
> Not really, it’s very heavily weighted in your favor. Consider it like rolling a die, 1 gets you a slightly worse deal, 2 to 6 gets you a significantly better deal.
If I have a 5 gem match on the board, and it explodes it away to give me 2 Mana… That’s working against me. 🤷♀️
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### Author:  [@Mithran](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Mithran)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 12:47pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/15 "2019-06-18T12:47:58Z")
My observations have been this, from the start, consistently (including with Omen traits before potions)
If you have any explosion at the start of battle, but no storm, you are likely to be in a less advantageous starting position on average because 4/5 matches are actually more common at battle start than with randomly falling stormless configurations (likely due to the slightly lower incidence of skulls on starting boards vs what will skyfall even with no storms making it slightly more likely that any random configuration of gems will contain a 4/5 match). TPK use is a huge example of this. You’ll also have slightly less (not skull) empowered converter alignment. Mana gain _might_ be about neutral over time on the _first_ match, but empowered converters, match traits, and cascades skew the advantage of having your “slightly less balanced” board more. (However, as I stated when I first did my examination of potions going through all the scenarios, enchant advantage generally makes up for this, and allows for team builds that wouldn’t have been viable otherwise)
If you have a storm set up, and 2 or more explosions at the start of battle, you’ll generally make up the difference with cascades (sometimes a _lot_ of mana, a new 4/5 match which might lead to _lots_ of 4/5 matches, or both, rarely purely a comparative disadvantage). If you have just 1 explosion and a storm, its about a wash on average.
So in my experience, over time, these four explosions trend toward _strongly_ advantageous if you are starting with a storm, and weakly disadvantageous otherwise (but not so disadvantageous to outweigh the advantage of having enchant).
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [June 18, 2019, 1:19pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/16 "2019-06-18T13:19:12Z")
Because of the Enchant though which you have to have it if you have the Explosions from potions.
I ask that you look into it again and stay at tier 1 and see that the 4 or 5 gem matches that you get fill your team just as fast. The difference being. You can cast them on the first turn still.
Also, you guys start with storms a lot more than me evidently.
If I have to change my talent tree to get a potion to work favorably then it doesn’t favor me automatically.
It’s like saying something tastes great and still adding salt to it… If it tastes great… Then it doesn’t need salt.
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [July 22, 2019, 5:08pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/17 "2019-07-22T17:08:51Z")
Originally my theory was debunked by the faith that the 4 Explosions were spread across the board so the odds say when you removed 12-24 gems that it’s going to screw up combos. Made sense. But more and more I notice these Explosions happen in a tiny grid with a huge tendency to target the tiny arena where I would of had a 4-5 gem match.
You don’t have to take my word for it. I don’t have to prove anything in vain because the devs are definitely already aware of it. I mean honestly… Given all the clear history of trying to slow our play down (minus 4x of course) what makes you think they would do things to speed us up when they also gave us enchant at the start of the match? I digress…I just want to the option of opting out of the illusion of speed that isn’t me regulating myself to only Tier 1 purchase per event (unrealistic work around).
I’m happy for those who enjoy it and am not suggesting to remove it completely. I just want the option with certain builds that I feel like get nerfed by this “buff” to turn the explosion potion off.
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### Author:  [@FeelTheBern](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/FeelTheBern)
#### Post date: [July 22, 2019, 5:45pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/18 "2019-07-22T17:45:08Z")
Easy solution
Close your eyes
Won’t miss what u don’t know exists
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### Author:  [@xolid99](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/xolid99)
#### Post date: [July 22, 2019, 5:56pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/19 "2019-07-22T17:56:14Z")
I’ve not thoroughly analysed the data, but I have yet to see a potion explosion not take away a 4/5 gem match and I’ve probably gone T2 in every single potion event since inception.
I started looking a couple of weeks ago and made a mental note of it, and nope, not once did it miss any 4/5 gem match. Granted it sometimes rejigged the board to another 4/5 gem match.
An option to _save_ or buy but not activate the explosion might be handy…
Another issue I’ve encountered, which is not the same as this one, but it relates to favourable AI explosions. In Map the Underworld, which seems to have 3 Dark Omen troops, plus Wrath - yesterday I got a Legendary one. On starting board it exploded the gems, and matched 6 skulls at the same time. When I got first turn, my top troop was 15 life from death. 3 enemies were full.
Even better than an empowered start…
The only weakness was that Wrath was not the first troop, as no doubt it would have killed a troop before starting.
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### Author:  [@Koromac](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Koromac)
#### Post date: [July 22, 2019, 6:04pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/potions-explosions-are-hurting-more-than-helping/55824/20 "2019-07-22T18:04:41Z")
I agree. You actually wrote this thread when I was about to post it.
Anyway, this Explosion thing should be replaced with the Enraged Perk for all four troops.
Problem solved.
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