# Life and Death....🤦 **URL:** \ **Category:** Feature Requests and Game feedback\ **Created:** [May 9, 2019, 7:11am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882 "2019-05-09T07:11:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Lyya](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/lyya/32/3650_2.png) [@Lyya](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyya)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 4:45am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/133 "2020-05-25T04:45:07Z")
Okay, fine, a warning. I’m going to start handing out suspensions if I see any more _ad hominem_ in this thread or otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![B12345](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a88e4f/32.png) [@B12345](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/B12345)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:59pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/134 "2020-05-25T19:59:31Z")
L&D is fine. I kill 95% of L&D orbweaver teams with my counter-L&D team. The 5% loss is due to bad starting boards. You just need to find someone with L&D from the top of pvp leaderboard and try your own teams against it until you make a successful team. Then don’t share that team anywhere and don’t use it as a defense team because L&D non-copy-pasta users will try to improve it to counter your now publicly known team. Then copy-pasters will copy paste it. ---
**Author:** ![Slypenslyde](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/slypenslyde/32/30373_2.png) [@Slypenslyde](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Slypenslyde)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 9:19pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/135 "2020-05-25T21:19:04Z")
I don’t know what’s changed but I feel even a month ago I had a lot more trouble with L&D than I do now? I haven’t really changed my team. I feel like Rope Dart’s been giving me more consistent trouble. I’m not really sure what changed. Either way I’ve always felt both of those weapons were above the “acceptable level of power” bar but I’ve been around that argument so many times. If anything I think a big part of the problem is the sameyness of PvP. If you _do_ have a problem with L&D and you _don’t_ have the mythical “great team” against it, then it’s a pain in the butt to skip over it every 2-3 matches. ---
**Author:** ![AmazonJax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/amazonjax/32/76865_2.png) [@AmazonJax](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/AmazonJax)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 9:23pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/136 "2020-05-25T21:23:37Z")
It’s not fine it needs nerfed. How do I know? Because over half of the defense teams out there use it. In the past popularity was equal to “too powerful”. When everyone used The Dragon Soul, it got nerfed. When everyone used wisps, it got nerfed. When everyone used Ubastet, it got nerfed. Time to cut the thing off by its head. ---
**Author:** ![TheIdleOne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@TheIdleOne](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/TheIdleOne)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 9:50pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/137 "2020-05-25T21:50:03Z")
> [@AmazonJax](#): > > Because over half of the defense teams out there use it. I attribute that to people are lazy. Why make a new defense when people just complain about a current one? There’s no point in actively trying to win on defense either, meaning there’s no reason to change defenses. ---
**Author:** ![AmazonJax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/amazonjax/32/76865_2.png) [@AmazonJax](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/AmazonJax)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 10:03pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/138 "2020-05-25T22:03:20Z")
All the more reason to nerf the thing. There’s hundreds of weapons out there. Be creative! ---
**Author:** ![Slypenslyde](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/slypenslyde/32/30373_2.png) [@Slypenslyde](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Slypenslyde)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 11:57pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/139 "2020-05-25T23:57:43Z")
Power isn’t distributed evenly among weapons. There might be hundreds of them, but there are probably less than 2 dozen weapons with anything approaching a power level. If you want L&D nerfed, here’s how you go about it: write a small essay laying out how its features give it a power level above and beyond other meta weapons. Maybe come up with a good subjective but repeatable way to measure weapon power. Lay out the natural counters to L&D and explain why you think they aren’t as effective as the counters to other weapons. Finally, propose what an adjusted L&D would look like, with discussion as to why that would keep it in place among meta weapons without making it so downplayed it’s useless. Then brace yourself, because the only response you’re going to get out of these forums is that you’re a dumb n00b who doesn’t know anything about teambuilding. Further, they’ll posit you want the game to be “too easy” therefore you want all good weapons nerfed. But right now you’re not talking about L&D. You’re talking about the lack of variety in PvP, which is a different problem that’s been around even longer than L&D. ---
**Author:** ![HounganAtLarge](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/hounganatlarge/32/28697_2.png) [@HounganAtLarge](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/HounganAtLarge)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2020, 5:24pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/140 "2020-05-26T17:24:00Z")
Except that our guild tracks wins by defense teams. L&D Orbweaver teams are consistently good. They may fare better on some days than others, but they are always effective. That’s why you see them so much in GW. ---
**Author:** ![TheIdleOne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@TheIdleOne](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/TheIdleOne)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2020, 6:53pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/141 "2020-05-26T18:53:51Z")
What bracket are you in? a lot of the L&D I see in Bracket 1 actually doesn’t win all that much. ---
**Author:** ![awryan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/awryan/32/74650_2.png) [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2020, 2:10pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/142 "2020-06-04T14:10:17Z")
Awwww we missed the release anniversary for life and death. I guess I was too busy Recruiting for the 20% of players who quit partly if not totally due to the balance change this weapon caused/causes. The devs used to nerf things when they saw it winning too much on defenses. Now they worship the same broken mechanics. I try to have it on my Ranked PvP defense as much as possible just to see it continually rack up wins. I get a chuckle (like a a dark comedy joke) and some free gems. Then I reflect on how the first 2 years of my GoW experience. Almost every patch had important balance changes that improved the game. The last important balance change was literally 13 months ago. And the game has only gotten worse since then. Now instead we get minor changes to garbage ass troops that no one used and continue not to use. Just so that the person in charge of it “looks like they are doing something” when they are really changing absolutely nothing balance wise, or enjoyment wise. ---
**Author:** ![awryan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/awryan/32/74650_2.png) [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2020, 9:32am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/143 "2020-12-23T09:32:24Z")
19 months later. Still blessed. But nerfed. > [@Naughty & Nice: Troop Balance](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/naughty-nice-troop-balance/67801): > > NAUGHTY & NICE: TROOP BALANCE Troop Balance The Dev Team’s made a list and we’ve gone and checked it twice, We’ve found some Troops and Weapons who’ve been Naughty or been Nice… The Nice Troops got some buffs to help them rise and shine, But the Naughty Troops got nerfed to help bring them back in line. [image] Nice Death Base damage increased from 15 to 25 Mana cost reduce from 24 to 20 War Mana cost reduce from 22 to 20 Plague Mana cost reduce from 22 to 20 Tian Yi Mana cost … ---
**Author:** ![Fleg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5e9695/32.png) [@Fleg](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Fleg)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2020, 10:30am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/144 "2020-12-23T10:30:37Z")
Bandit got a huge buff though so easily cancels this nerf out. ---
**Author:** ![awryan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/awryan/32/74650_2.png) [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2020, 10:38am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882/145 "2020-12-23T10:38:24Z")
> [@Fleg](#): > > Bandit got a huge buff though so easily cancels this nerf out. Bandit was nerfed as well. So you must mean the trait refund. Because of course you do. The trait refund is temporary. So fast forward to the new generation that will trait Bandit before they know any better and we’re back to Life and Death being Nerfed. Fleg, you trying to argue that another troops balance changes offset a weapons nerf is the most Fleggy argument you’ve ever Flegged. Merry Christmas man. Keep flegging on with your Fleg self. [Previous page](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/life-and-death/54882.md?page=6)