# Guild "agreement" in bracket1 to arrange scores **URL:** \ **Category:** Archive\ **Created:** [September 25, 2017, 7:00am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740 "2017-09-25T07:00:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Vangor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/vangor/32/31404_2.png) [@Vangor](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Vangor)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:22am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/147 "2017-09-26T04:22:00Z")
> [@Saluki](#): > > Salty herself said “If we see it affecting results in any significant way we will implement some changes to punish this kind of behavior.” > > If you say you will punish the behavior, that means you had a stance against it 💯💯 to this ---
**Author:** ![Lyya](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/lyya/32/3650_2.png) [@Lyya](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyya)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:22am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/148 "2017-09-26T04:22:14Z")
Maybe the data shows they _weren’t_ cheating. You can’t assume that the data they have meshes with what is externally observable. Regardless, the potential for this problem of collusion to exist will mean the subject will come up over and over until it is addressed by a systems change to make it impossible (or at least impractical). I believe that the team will incorporate the learnings from this and other points regarding GW to make it a better experience for honest players going forward, but folks will need to be patient. A formal stance against the practice, and the implied threat that tools may be deployed on the back-end at any time to punish cheaters, will have to do in the meantime. ---
**Author:** ![Saluki](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/saluki/32/10639_2.png) [@Saluki](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Saluki)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:22am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/149 "2017-09-26T04:22:19Z")
This from Salty on May 7th: Looking at the issue, I think we can all agree that this sort of approach isn’t in the spirit of Guild Wars. If we see it affecting results in any significant way we will implement some changes to punish this kind of behavior. Thats seems to me to be a statement that if found it would be punished, does it not? ---
**Author:** ![Mezmoron1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e4f/32.png) [@Mezmoron1](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Mezmoron1)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:22am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/150 "2017-09-26T04:22:34Z")
Even the best guilds in the game (skill, not trophies) can’t go 148-2 in a day. Cheaters however, can. Don’t backpeddle on this issue. The game and player-base suffers from it. ---
**Author:** ![MrsAffects](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/mrsaffects/32/73668_2.png) [@MrsAffects](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/MrsAffects)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:26am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/151 "2017-09-26T04:26:52Z")
We fight hard on the console GW in the top bracket. There is no way we could do something like this. Is this a PC thing? We would never collab like that. That takes too much time and effort. Sad ---
**Author:** ![Saltypatra](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/saltypatra/32/59750_2.png) [@Saltypatra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Saltypatra)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:27am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/152 "2017-09-26T04:27:05Z")
I said “we will implement changes to punish this behaviour.” This doesn’t mean we will retroactively punish guilds, just that we would implement changes. Which we are planning on doing. There are some changes we would like to roll out for Guild Wars over future updates that will greatly discourage collusion. These will primarily deal with how defense teams are treated. ---
**Author:** ![Rickygervais](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b77776/32.png) [@Rickygervais](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Rickygervais)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:27am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/153 "2017-09-26T04:27:58Z")
> [@MrsAffects](#): > > We fight hard on the console GW in the top bracket. There is no way we could do something like this. Is this a PC thing? We would never collab like that. That takes too much time and effort. Sad there is currently 2 sister guild in bracket 1, how can you be sure they won’t help each other? ---
**Author:** ![MrsAffects](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/mrsaffects/32/73668_2.png) [@MrsAffects](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/MrsAffects)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:29am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/154 "2017-09-26T04:29:03Z")
They can’t be the top 4. There’s no way. I can imagine who tho from this war we just had. 😡😡😡 ---
**Author:** ![Rickygervais](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b77776/32.png) [@Rickygervais](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Rickygervais)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:29am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/155 "2017-09-26T04:29:08Z")
> [@Saltypatra](#): > > These will primarily deal with how defense teams are treated. interesting but if it work with team strengh, it can affect low level player since they don’t have very strong cards ---
**Author:** ![MrsAffects](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/mrsaffects/32/73668_2.png) [@MrsAffects](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/MrsAffects)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:29am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/156 "2017-09-26T04:29:59Z")
Meaning those below the top 4. ---
**Author:** ![Vangor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/vangor/32/31404_2.png) [@Vangor](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Vangor)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:30am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/157 "2017-09-26T04:30:48Z")
All right… It is getting late for me and i have to work tomorrow and i am sure that today has been quite stressful for you @Saltypatra so i will say my final thoughts on the issue and then go to bed… It should be noted that there are several people in this thread that i usually have a poor relationship with but we all kinda agree about this. That should mean something i think… G’night everyone… ---
**Author:** ![ZooKeeper](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/zookeeper/32/30875_2.png) [@ZooKeeper](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/ZooKeeper)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:34am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/158 "2017-09-26T04:34:19Z")
> [@Saltypatra](#): > > I said “we will implement changes to punish this behaviour.” You said that over 3 months ago and I didn’t see any changes. I understand there was no prove that time but now we have prove and it’s still not enough because you _can’t detect it_ by yourself which makes me dumbfounded. ---
**Author:** ![Rickygervais](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b77776/32.png) [@Rickygervais](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Rickygervais)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:35am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/159 "2017-09-26T04:35:27Z")
@Saltypatra as example, last week i fighted against a 1 troop defense and there was not team collusion, just someone who forgot to set a defense team. so my question is, how can you determine if this is legit or it’s cheating? ---
**Author:** ![Vangor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/vangor/32/31404_2.png) [@Vangor](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Vangor)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:39am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/160 "2017-09-26T04:39:47Z")
Oh wait! One last thing i meant to say but got distracted… I and on behalf of my guild formally and publicly make these statements 1. We shall NEVER engage im this collusion behavior regardless of what bracket we are in. I have instructed my guild if anyone approaches them with a collusion offer to take a SS and send it to me so i can report them. 2. We as a guild fully support @madking’s decision to bring this forward and we stand by Black Dragon to speak out against cheating. ---
**Author:** ![MrsAffects](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/mrsaffects/32/73668_2.png) [@MrsAffects](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/MrsAffects)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:40am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/161 "2017-09-26T04:40:39Z")
> [@Rickygervais](#): > > against a 1 troop defense I have played that one troop defense person multiple times, whoever that is does that on purpose. Easy win. If it’s the same person. ---
**Author:** ![Saltypatra](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/saltypatra/32/59750_2.png) [@Saltypatra](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Saltypatra)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:41am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/162 "2017-09-26T04:41:02Z")
“If we see it affecting results in any significant way we will implement some changes to punish this kind of behavior.” We wanted to see IF it would be a significant problem first, as if it wasn’t we wouldn’t need to allocate significant time and resources into fixing something that was not a problem. @Rickygervais, that is why we are looking into this closely now. We are working on a way to tell clearly if players are cheating. This may mean we need to implement something that helps us determine this. ---
**Author:** ![Stripy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6bbea6/32.png) [@Stripy](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Stripy)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:41am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/163 "2017-09-26T04:41:11Z")
I have defended a number of controversial decisions in the past because I felt the user base over reacted. I am not defending this one. The devs collectively indicated months ago that if collusion impacted the results they would act. If stats above are correct then the guilds in question have cheated and should be punished (i.e. as a first warning kick them down ten brackets and leave individuals untouched) I also flately reject the devs don’t have the information to detect this. Extract out the last ten weeks of bracket 1 guild results ( daily war results ie. black dragon vs tyrant) release it to the user base and if there is systemic cheating it will stand out like a sore thumb. Please do this to give clarity. Convert names to guild aa, guild ab… if you must… but do the analysis and make it transparent ---
**Author:** ![GemsOfWar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/2acd7d/32.png) [@GemsOfWar](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/GemsOfWar)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:47am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/164 "2017-09-26T04:47:24Z")
> [@Lyya](#): > > but folks will need to be patient. I read this as forks will need to be patient and was imagining patient pitchforks, maybe casually leaning up against the lynching tree 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Mezmoron1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e4f/32.png) [@Mezmoron1](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Mezmoron1)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:48am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/165 "2017-09-26T04:48:06Z")
@Stripy hit the nail on the head. ---
**Author:** ![Ashasekayi](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/ashasekayi/32/61090_2.png) [@Ashasekayi](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Ashasekayi)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2017, 4:48am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740/166 "2017-09-26T04:48:50Z")
> [@Saltypatra](#): > > We believe that collusion is not within the spirit of Guild Wars. If we get solid proof of collusion in future (on our side as well, not just data collected by players) there will be consequences, which at the very least will be the removal of rewards. The guilds in question will also possibly be demoted to a lower bracket. I’m glad that the company has finally made it clear that guild collusion is against the rules since it has “significantly” affected the integrity of GW. I truly hope that the future changes to GW will just prevent collusion in the first place. It has been suggested that defenses could be locked in on Monday with only colors used as indicators (no guild names). Of course, that only helps if matchups within the bracket are random instead of fixed like they are now. [Previous page](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740.md?page=7) [Next page](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/guild-agreement-in-bracket1-to-arrange-scores/30740.md?page=9)