# Dead Thread (15 characters) **URL:** \ **Category:** Gameplay Chat (PC/Mobile)\ **Created:** [September 7, 2017, 3:02pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952 "2017-09-07T15:02:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Lyya](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/lyya/32/3650_2.png) [@Lyya](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyya)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:11pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/42 "2017-09-07T19:11:44Z")
I feel like 100% chance at full-green explosions plus extra turn was too much. What about: Explode a random number of Green Gems (at least one). Gain an Extra Turn. ---
**Author:** ![Vangor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/vangor/32/31404_2.png) [@Vangor](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Vangor)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:12pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/43 "2017-09-07T19:12:58Z")
Maybe instead of pure random a range like 4-12 green gems ---
**Author:** ![Zuboki](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/zuboki/32/28558_2.png) [@Zuboki](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Zuboki)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:18pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/44 "2017-09-07T19:18:02Z")
Shameless self-promotion, but my idea is in line with this manner of thinking: > [@Princess Fizzbang change & hotfix](http://community.gemsofwar.com/t/princess-fizzbang-change-hotfix/29935/114): > > @Sirrian, a humble proposal to make her fun, thematic, and balanced: Extra Turn and: Fizzbang- Explode 2 random Green gems. Buff an ally, as current. OR Misfire- Explode all Green gems, and burn 2 allies. This has risk, reward, and a reasonable amount of mana gain no matter which result occurs. With your current nerf, getting the buff is pretty unrewarding, as most likely it will not hit a useful troop/stat. Getting 5 to 12 mana from the 2 explosions is a good consolation prize. On the ot… ---
**Author:** ![Stan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/stan/32/29888_2.png) [@Stan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Stan)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:21pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/45 "2017-09-07T19:21:16Z")
> [@Lyya](#): > > I feel like 100% chance at full-green explosions plus extra turn was too much. What about: > > Explode a random number of Green Gems (at least one). Gain an Extra Turn. Even with no buff at all, that seems like too much? Not arguing, just curious… Is it just too much mana generated (essentially guaranteeing that some other Goblin is going to fill up and keep the cycle going)? ---
**Author:** ![Lyya](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/lyya/32/3650_2.png) [@Lyya](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyya)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:22pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/46 "2017-09-07T19:22:41Z")
Might be, but I think it’s borderline, because a single Green explosion + Extra Turn would actually be worse than Goblin Rocket, where you have control over what you explode. So sometimes she’d be great, and other times she’d be mediocre, but no matter what, you could count on her for some mana, some _board manipulation_, and an extra turn. What makes her feel so bad after the nerf, in my opinion, is not necessarily the mana you don’t gain when she misfires but the fact that she doesn’t shake up the board at all in that case. ---
**Author:** ![Stan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/stan/32/29888_2.png) [@Stan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Stan)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:25pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/47 "2017-09-07T19:25:55Z")
Goblin rocket also does damage when he casts, so it should definitely be more than 1 gem exploded for PF, just to keep pace with GR. ---
**Author:** ![Lyya](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/lyya/32/3650_2.png) [@Lyya](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyya)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:27pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/48 "2017-09-07T19:27:18Z")
But Fizzbang has the potential to destroy the whole board, so it’d balance out. Sometimes she’d be worse than Rocket (when the die roll gives you one kaboom), usually she’d be better (when it gives you 2+). In my opinion, that’d really cement her as a reckless exploder. Sometimes you get huge explosions, sometimes just itty bitty ones. Either way, you get to go again. ---
**Author:** ![Stan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/stan/32/29888_2.png) [@Stan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Stan)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:30pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/49 "2017-09-07T19:30:29Z")
> [@Lyya](#): > > Either way, you get to go again. Yes, in a previous post, you’d mentioned that casting her now can feel like a wasted move, but you’re still buffing something and getting an extra turn, so you are unquestionably better off than when you started. Between the art, lore and concept of this troop, I feel like it should be fun and goofy, so a random number of exploded gems, or even some of the suggestions like having a random chance of something bad happening to your own troops, feels appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![Lyya](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/lyya/32/3650_2.png) [@Lyya](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyya)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:31pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/50 "2017-09-07T19:31:37Z")
True…then again, we already have Nobend Brothers for the “random chance of something random” happening. I think her identity should be cemented as an exploder, and not a buffer. That’s my two cents, though, and I recognize not everyone agrees. ---
**Author:** ![Amadan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/amadan/32/7653_2.png) [@Amadan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Amadan)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:32pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/51 "2017-09-07T19:32:50Z")
Instead of a random _number_ of gems, just make it random _gems_; e.g, **“Explode X (3, 5, whatever) random Green gems (or hell, just “random gems” with no color qualifier). Gain an extra turn.”** She’d still feel like she did before; she’d have a random element; she couldn’t blow up the entire board; she wouldn’t touch stats. ---
**Author:** ![Vangor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/vangor/32/31404_2.png) [@Vangor](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Vangor)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/52 "2017-09-07T19:33:33Z")
I just want to add that i am enjoying this discussion so thank you @Stan and @Lyya. Fizzy was well on her way to becoming my favorite troop until this morning and i would live to se her set back on that path ---
**Author:** ![Razzagor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/razzagor/32/50037_2.png) [@Razzagor](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Razzagor)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:35pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/53 "2017-09-07T19:35:52Z")
My general experience with her was: - Paired with Nobend Brothers: Her explosions could sometimes fill the little rascals, if they cast another explosion, then things could go on for a while as Fizzy could refill again. It repeats the loop dangerously if Fizzy gives magic to Nobend Brothers. - If she was in third position, safe from Khorvash mana drain, but not from King Highforge and Kraken spells i would need to rethink what team i should use. Highforge is a solid choice to stun her and allow some other dwarf to finish her off. - If she was paired with Mab, i would risk having a bad time because at least one of my troops could be frozen… Maw can take Mab and usually plow through the goblins to victory, but if i lose Maw and IK the battle is over. Happened a few times. Didn’t had many battle against her because of my limited time for the game lately. ---
**Author:** ![Stan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/stan/32/29888_2.png) [@Stan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Stan)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:37pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/54 "2017-09-07T19:37:05Z")
> [@Vangor](#): > > Fizzy was well on her way to becoming my favorite troop I showed my wife the art and concept of Princess Fizzbang and she was really excited to get her. The thought of having her, Holly Hobgoblin, Queen Grapplepot and Bugbear (I can’t tell you what she calls this guy, but it is funny in a very non-PC way) on a single team would make up for a lot of negatives in the game. I know that’s not an ideal Goblin team, but sometimes you just have to do what makes you happy and not worry about min-maxing everything. ---
**Author:** ![Vangor](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/vangor/32/31404_2.png) [@Vangor](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Vangor)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:39pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/55 "2017-09-07T19:39:40Z")
> [@Stan](#): > > I can’t tell you what she calls this guy, but it is funny in a very non-PC way You simply must PM me this! I could use a hearty laugh! ---
**Author:** ![Eika](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/eika/32/103088_2.png) [@Eika](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Eika)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 7:39pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/56 "2017-09-07T19:39:40Z")
Its good to see that so many wants another rework on her. Keeps my hopes UP! 🕶☀ ---
**Author:** ![Amadan](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/amadan/32/7653_2.png) [@Amadan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Amadan)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 8:06pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/57 "2017-09-07T20:06:59Z")
Actually, let’s run through the math to differentiate her from Goblin Rocket. - Assume players using the Rocket will almost always target a gem on the inner portion of the board, to hit 9 gems with the explosion. The only reason to choose anything else would be to deliberately cause a match-4 or somesuch, but that’s really unquantifiable so let’s stick with the simple assumption. - With 4 corners that each hit 4 gems when exploded, 24 edge spots that each hit 6 gems when exploded, and 36 inner spots that each hit 9 gems when exploded, if there are equal odds to choose any one spot then an average randomly-selected explosion would hit 7.5625 gems. - Let’s account for Goblin Rocket’s damage. \*\* The simplest “direct damage to a random enemy” with no other effect that I can find offhand is the Hunter’s Spear, which costs 6 mana for (Magic+3) damage. \*\* Goblin Rocket, conveniently enough, also deals (Magic+3) damage, so let’s say that 6 mana’s worth of his ability cost goes to his damage. That means the remaining 5 mana of his ability cost buys an extra turn plus an explosion that hits 9 gems. \*\* Without being able to break the costs down further, let’s just stay simple and assume that the 5 mana is split 50/50 between the extra turn and the gems. So now, we can say that the extra turn is worth 2.5 mana, and hitting 9 gems with an explosion is worth 2.5 mana (or 3.6 gems per point of mana). - Princess Fizzbang’s ability costs 13 mana. Let’s work it backwards with the same baselines as the Goblin Rocket: spend 2.5 points for the extra turn, and we have 10.5 points left. 10.5 points at 3.6 gems per point of mana means her explosions would hit 37.8 gems with her remaining budget. - If an average randomly-selected explosion hits 7.5625 gems, then in order to hit 37.8 gems, Fizzbang would need to explode 4.99 gems. Ta da! **“Explode 5 random gems. Gain an extra turn.”** with no additional effect, at a 13 mana cost, would keep her balanced similarly to the Goblin Rocket while still retaining the unique feel (and fun!) that she had to begin with. ---
**Author:** ![Ninertwo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/ninertwo/32/31489_2.png) [@Ninertwo](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Ninertwo)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 9:05pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/58 "2017-09-07T21:05:57Z")
I know how much fun she was to play on pvp, but she was on her way to completely destroying guild wars, which is a major focus on a lot of players. Talk about Kerberos FG all over again but a zillion times worse. It was fully possible to make one or two moves, then never get another move because of her spell. That might be fun in pvp where it was a race to power your fizzbang first, but using monocolors and having no direct counter I.E red day and having only 5 battles with REAL consequence (it’s costing me gems 💎) is zero fun and a tad bit stressful. ---
**Author:** ![Arelana](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/arelana/32/16081_2.png) [@Arelana](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Arelana)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 9:12pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/59 "2017-09-07T21:12:29Z")
> [@Ninertwo](#): > > but she was on her way to completely destroying guild wars She’s still pretty beastly on defense, so I wouldn’t say we’re out of the woods there. ---
**Author:** ![Ninertwo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex019/user_avatar/community.gemsofwar.com/ninertwo/32/31489_2.png) [@Ninertwo](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Ninertwo)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 9:13pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/60 "2017-09-07T21:13:58Z")
Oh she is but I can handle her now ---
**Author:** ![sathriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/73ab20/32.png) [@sathriel](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/sathriel)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2017, 9:21pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952/61 "2017-09-07T21:21:06Z")
“The stat buff didn’t fit with her to begin with (how is she exploding you healthier or exploding you meaner?). Remove the stat buff entirely, and return the explosion and extra turn to how it was, and she’ll “feel right” again without runaway inflation slamming allies’ stats up to 1000.” For the love of Tentacled Deities could you people stop applying logic to a match 3 game with CCG elements? We are talking about a game where beasts eat robots and skeletons, you know. [Previous page](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952.md?page=2) [Next page](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/dead-thread-15-characters/29952.md?page=4)