# Bug Wars (put it out of it's misery... already)
**URL:** https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075
**Category:** Feature Requests and Game feedback
**Created:** [February 14, 2019, 6:35pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075 "2019-02-14T18:35:39Z")
**Posts on this page:** 8
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2019, 6:18pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075/21 "2019-02-15T18:18:58Z")
> [@Slypenslyde](#):
>
> I mean how could _2 people_ in the entire world have internet issues at the same time? That seems preposterous. I’ve never been in a situation like that before. We all know only one person is allowed to have an internet problem at a time.
Knowing that nothing I say will suffice to change your mind about this “coincidence”. They both had the same issue against the Paragon they were facing for brown day.
Seems much more rational to blame a one in a million coincidence than another bug in guild wars.
I’ve never had a connection issue. But there’s been at least 2 times where I won a GW match and it showed up as a loss instead.
As recent as this week there was a bug report where the following days match showed up as a loss. Even without that day even starting yet.
So whether you believe it’s all a coincidence or not. It’s a fact that there’s still bugs in guild wars. Not new bugs, old bugs that it seems they can’t fix. 🤷
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### Author:  [@Amadan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Amadan)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2019, 6:55pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075/22 "2019-02-15T18:55:38Z")
> [@Slypenslyde](#):
>
> The only choices I can see are like:
>
> 1. Disconnects trigger a restart.
> 2. Disconnects count as a loss.
The only real option as I see it is “reconnect into the same match, at the same point, and…just keep playing”. Why should a disconnect count as anything, or change the game state at all?
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2019, 7:09pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075/23 "2019-02-15T19:09:18Z")
> [@Amadan](#):
>
> The only real option as I see it is “reconnect into the same match, at the same point, and…just keep playing”. Why should a disconnect count as anything, or change the game state at all?
It doesn’t. And for both players the game just restarted on its own. There wasn’t any player input at all from what I understand.
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### Author:  [@Slypenslyde](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Slypenslyde)
#### Post date: [February 15, 2019, 7:28pm UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075/24 "2019-02-15T19:28:09Z")
I forgot about this possibility and I like it, but it has to be implemented in an extremely frustrating way to avoid exploits. Let me walk you through it and why that’s the case.
For it to work, your device has to tell the server every move you make _before it commits the move_. That means if you swap two gems or cast an ability, you have to watch the spinny “busy” icon until the server has been told what the move is and responded “yes, I’ve saved that move.” That feels like we’d probably see delays of 4-5 seconds per move. Maybe that’s a small price to pay, I’m not really going to argue on that or express an opinion.
If we don’t do that, and moves are committed later or local state is saved and synced on reconnect, then a whole mess of exploits open up.
The easiest is to cut your internet connection before making a move. Then you make your move and watch the results. If you like them, you “reconnect”. If you don’t, you quit the game and restart. The game only knows it was waiting on your move, and allows you to make it again. Score!
So a counter to that is, “Well if you’re disconnected, what if the game saves the move you made and sends that as soon as you reconnect?” Well, especially on PC and Android, it’s not smart to trust a client’s local state. Tools can be made to edit it. Even if it’s encrypted, it only takes one person to make a tool that helps many cheaters. There are also other nasty cases like, “Well, what if a bug causes a crash that corrupts the local move state such that the server can’t interpret it?” If the response is “let the player make another move” we’re back to the last case.
Cheaters are persistent.
So the only fail-proof way to do it I can see is the game would have to commit a move to the server AND get a response _before_ showing you the results of that move. That way a cheater has no way to get information about a move without committing the move (ignoring the tools that already exist to assist cheaters.)
So that’s the cost, in addition to all the dev work it’d entail: are players willing to put up with a multiple-second delay per move in GW? We also have to deal with other shrapnel, the most obvious being, “Well, even if the RNG seed is the same, other sources of entropy on the system will have advanced their states and “luck” won’t be the same after a disconnect”. Plus there’s the fact that most parties in this conversation already believe the game is rigged to force player losses.
I think it’s a lot of work that wouldn’t make even a fraction of the playerbase happier.
---
### Author:  [@Lyya](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Lyya)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2019, 3:35am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075/25 "2019-02-16T03:35:34Z")
You’re right, the only foolproof path is to move game state to the server, which would be detrimental in many ways to the current experience. That being said, there are ways to make this difficult (though not impossible) to hack without requiring state to be kept server-side. (On the platforms where such an exploit could even occur, i.e. Steam mostly), much more severe exploits already exist that would be a simpler attack vector and these have existed for years.
It’s simply unlikely to be worth the dev time to implement game serialization for suspend/resume, and that’s why we have never seen it.
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### Author:  [@vanyel](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/vanyel)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2019, 4:14am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075/26 "2019-02-16T04:14:50Z")
> [@awryan](#):
>
> They both had the same issue against the Paragon they were facing for brown day.
Might you know if both players were fighting the paragon at the same time? Or at least were they fighting their battles close enough to each other that it’s possible they could have been fighting the battle at the same time?
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### Author:  [@awryan](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/awryan)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2019, 5:56am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075/27 "2019-05-09T05:56:55Z")
Just noticed some reports of new bugs in Guild Wars.
Time to necro this thread. 🤦
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### Author:  [@Rojo1](https://community.gemsofwar.com/u/Rojo1)
#### Post date: [May 9, 2019, 6:48am UTC](https://community.gemsofwar.com/t/bug-wars-put-it-out-of-its-misery-already/52075/28 "2019-05-09T06:48:03Z")
Maybe it’s their internet 😉
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